this post was submitted on 09 May 2025
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"If you're going to start a meeting with fat shaming me, then yes; I am going to fire back. Don't dish it out if you can't take it yourself.
If you have a problem with that, we can get the lawyers involved and discuss it further."
But I also live somewhere that actually has labour laws and where 'at-will' employment is a ridiculous concept. If you want to fire someone (after their three months probation), you've gotta have a good reason and you better document it throughly.
"At will" isn't as magical as people think.
If you terminate an employee without documented cause, you still have to pay them unemployment.
In practice this just means that your documented cause will be fabricated.
It doesn't really need to be fabricated. It's stupid easy to build a case to legitimately fire anyone.
Not really. I used to work in management for a major outdoors retail chain and we had employees we desperately wanted to fire because they were lazy and toxic rowards other staff and customers, but since they showed up on time and in uniform corporate wouldn't let us do it because they didn't want to pay unemployment.
Being toxic to customers is probably counter indicated in the employee handbook, especially for a retail chain.
Your management could have written them up for it 3 times then fired them, but they couldn't be bothered to do the paperwork.
they can just say they're downsizing, or the employee hasn't been performing well, or any other lie. as long as they don't specifically mention that you're being terminated for something illegal you'll never stand a chance in court.
that being said. record every meeting with hr, they slip up more than you think
That's simply not true.
If you're laid off they have to pay unemployment. If you aren't performing well they have to show records proving it when you file unemployment and they try to deny the claim.
Please don't talk about topics on which you're clearly uninformed, because the belief that someon3 can be fired for anything with no recourse keeps people from filing for unemployment when they're 100% eligible.
All "at will" means is that they can fire you for any reason or no reason. They may still be required to pay unemployment, but they don't have to keep you on staff.
I'm in PA, so yeah unfortunately this is how it goes. hats off to y'all in states with slightly better laws, but this is how it goes in my state. I speak from personal experience as well as the experience of my friends.
and all that documentation can be easily fabricated or cherry picked to try to make a point that isn't there.
it doesn't matter how the system is supposed to work, the laws in this country and PA especially are so fucked that it very rarely works out in the employees favor. you can potentially get unemployment, but wrongful termination suits very rarely go anywhere.
No, that's not how it works in PA or any state.
You're incorrect regarding unemployment eligibility as it relates to at-will employment status, and since you don't know what you're talking about you need to shut the fuck up before you discourage people from even attempting to pursue their rights when they lose their job.
lol. you sound like someone who has never tried to file for any of that shit. from another one of your comments, sounds like you had some corporate experience in firing people.
your experience in the corporate world firing people is not what people on the other side of the axe experience.
people should absolutely file for unemployment and pursue wrongful termination suits if possible. but your expectation that things will fall into their lap is unrealistic and will cost people money if they lose an appeal and are required to pay their benefits back.
Once again, you're wrong about many, many things.
Filing for unemployment costs nothing. When the company tries to deny the claim, you can appeal that for free, the company is required to provide evidence, and they frequently lose.
Wrongful termination is an entirely different thing than termination without cause and it's clear that you don't know that. This is why you need to shut the fuck up and stop telling people to give up when you don't know what you're talking about at all.
Saying someone has had quite a few cupcakes isn't necessarily fatshaming. It can just be calling out someone hogging the cupcakes.