this post was submitted on 10 Oct 2024
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Mildly Infuriating

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Was trying to read a news story and... What fresh shitfuckery is this? Why do I now have to pay money to a company just for the privilege of not being spied upon and not getting your cookies that I don't want or need? How is this even legal?

RE: "Why are you even reading that shitrag?" -- I clicked on a link someone posted in another sublemmit, didn't realise it was the Sun till after. I do not read the Sun on the regular, chill. My point stands regardless that this is extremely shitty and should probably not be allowed.

(page 2) 44 comments
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[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (2 children)

Solution: don't read that shitrag. It was always a waste of paper, now it is a waste of bandwidth as well.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (2 children)

How is this even legal?

Because Brits voted Brrrrexit?

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

How is that not extortion?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (6 children)

Because you aren't compelled to use their site.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I am really fucking sick and tired of every goddamn company thinking they're entitled to colonize my property and hack it to serve them instead of me.

My computer is my property, you fascist fucks, not yours, and my actual property rights trump your Imaginary "Property" "rights" (i.e. temporary government-granted privileges) every single time and in every single circumstance!

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I broadly agree with your sentiment, in particular computing equipment that I purchase and ongoing trends in tech (like smart TVs) that are abusive to consumers.

However, I find this argument not terribly persuasive in this particular case. The content of a website isn't an extension of your property. It is not even public property. Visiting a site is voluntary. You clearly didn't pay for accessing the site, nor was it subsidized through a social program. So exactly how should content (regardless of how trashy it is) be funded? Statements like "rights" (i.e. temporary government-granted privileges) suggest you are espousing libertarian views, but at the same time, you are not expressing willingness to pay for a service privately?

I dunno, it just comes across as demanding a handout. Meanwhile, not visiting websites that don't meet your vision for how funding content should be done seems like a perfectly simple and reasonable approach to have for this problem.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (2 children)

Jokes on you, to remember your choice for no coockies they have to use a cookie.

Ublock origins -> select element -> remove

Or auto accept/refuse cookies with extension, then auto delete cookies for all but approved sites when closing browser.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I still don't care about Cookies + Cooking Auto-Delete is what I do. Do whatever the fuck is needed to get rid of the cookie banner and then delete all cookies when closing the tab.

I don't even whitelist websites, I just don't need cookies

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Is a password manager, maybe with automatic login or at least autofill, part of your stack?

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

I mean, I'm not opposed to all cookies. Ones that I actually need like that one are fine. Just dont track me kthxbye...

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

Bild is doing this shit too.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

When I was working on data protection issues, I asked a specialist lawyer more than two years ago how something like this could be reconciled with the GDPR. He couldn't answer the question, but said that with the best will in the world he couldn't imagine that this would be OK under data protection law. Nevertheless, this approach is now common practice for the vast majority of news sites in Europe and also in the EU, which has strict regulations regarding tracking, at least in theory. I still don't know the legal details, but at least I know that there are no serious penalties whatsoever if there is no distortion of competition involved - and since none of the news companies would sue another in this matter, this has become common practice even in the EU.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

Can confirm this.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Is this a question, a suggestion, or some kind of stroke? Do you need medical attention?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

its an extension that can be added to FF/chrome. it "cleans" up the webpage so you don't get the anti-ad-blocker/cookie crap on websites.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

Not any factor lotion will protect your mental health from "the Sun" o_O

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

The red flag there in the screenshot shows you the name of the publication you should avoid using or visiting.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)
  • Just set up your browser to delete cookies on exit. If you want, just have it delete them from specifically that site. The entire debate over whether-or-not a site sets a cookie seems to me to be pretty pointless. If a site can set cookies, then some bad actor will. The dialogs that sites put up talking about it are pointless. No solution other than having your browser not retain them regardless of what a site wants to do is going to be a reliable solution. Not policies, not laws.

    I have my browser delete all cookies on exit. I have a very short whitelist of sites that I permit to keep cookies and track me. Every one of those is one that I need to log in to use anyway -- so I could be tracked with or without a cookie -- and the only thing the cookie does is buys me not needing to log in every time, doesn't have privacy implications.

  • Paying doesn't buy you anything unless they offer a no-log, no-data-mining policy. If you log in to use the site, then they can track you anyway via the credentials you use.

  • They're not imposing it on you. They're offering you a service that costs them money. They give you news, you give them money or data. If you don't want to do that deal, there's a whole Internet out there. Don't go to that particular site. There are lots of websites out there, many of which offer the same deal. Getting upset that somewhere on the Internet, someone is offering a deal that you don't want seems pointless.

    If you want to have some kind of tax-funded news site, go advocate for that. Yelling at them isn't going to get you there.

    If you want to just view news done by volunteers, something like WikiNews, then go visit those sites instead. Maybe contribute work as well. I don't think that volunteer news is going to realistically compete with commercial news, but hey, there was also a point when people thought the same thing about volunteer-run encyclopedias, so maybe it'll get there.

I'll also add that I'm going to be generous to the EU and assume that the goal of their "cookie warning" law, which is why many European websites show these, was to raise awareness of cookies and privacy implications by having warnings plastered all over, so that it starts people thinking about privacy. Because if the goal was actually to let people avoid cookies, then it is costly, disruptive and wildly ineffectual compared to just setting a setting in the browser, makes actually having the browser delete cookies more-annoying, and duplicates a browser-side standard, P3P, that already accomplished something similar, and was just all around a really bad law.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 days ago (3 children)

OP, The Sun is one of the trashiest rags on the face of this Earth. Your best option regardless of their ad practices was always to stay well away from them.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Oh I know, I clicked a link here on lemmy and was taken to that site. I never read it otherwise, but now Im definitely not reading it...

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (5 children)

you can block websites if you want if you’re on voyager. It’ll filter out posts which link to whatever websites you list.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

I use voyager and I love you for sharing this. fuck the s*n.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

Radical approach, because I might miss the post with interesting comments, and people often provide alternative links or straight up embed summaries.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

oh man that's an incredible option. i was already super happy with the "share as image" option they have, but it seems like they just keep outdoing themselves

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

Oooh, good tip. Didn’t know about that feature.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (2 children)

I'm on Sync. I might have a look later.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Ooh you can share settings like this? Whoa...

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

One of the best Sync features. Long press on any setting to copy a link to your clipboard.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

I wouldn’t bother switching for a fewture like that. Just wanted to share incase you were on voyager.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 days ago (1 children)

private session by default and using start page as your search engine with Anonymous View to search the pages saves the cookies but they are worthless one you leave the site

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (1 children)

Okay, but that's still a lot of effort, and loads more effort than 90% of users would be willing to go through. All so these fucks can (try to) sell my data to 19000 different 'vendors' and their 'legitimate interests'. I swear this needs to be legally regulated somehow before we end up having to pay these people to not monitor our webcams while we read their shitty tabloids.

BTW I do use searXNG and Startpage

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (2 children)

If you're on Firefox, you can also have certain sites automatically open in containers. "Sure, put cookies on my machine if you want. You can see me only browsing your website ever."

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

Containers are great.

What do you think - cookie autodelete sound a little more private? “If you can’t fingerprint my browser, this might as well be my first visit to this website“

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

That's the solution I've landed on for using Youtube, since Invidious and Piped always cack the bed for me. I've deleted my old Google account and started a new one with a fake email address, too.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

Good strategy for dealing with them. Reminds me that on the Hacker News article about the Internet Archive hack, a couple of commenters reported on whether they found their email addresses in the leak. They called them their "unique-to-archive.org email addresses."

The more we compartmentalize, the better off we are, I think.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 days ago (1 children)

It's legal because the Sun is a private company and they have the right to charge you to not datamine you. It's not a public service and they're not the only source of news out there, so you have a choice: if you don't like it, get your news elsewhere.

What's the problem exactly?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 days ago (2 children)

I'm no fan of ads, but you're right. Expecting everything for free with no ads is just greedy.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I don’t mind ads, but I don’t expect to be tracked around the internet. It’s like every website you visit being able to view your browser history. That’s private information.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

Technically, whatever the Sun prints is private information available for purchase. You can either pay cash or trade their information for yours.

I still get frustrated by it, so I understand where you're coming from. My local paper is ONLY viewable with a subscription. There are ways around it, like turning off JavaScript, but if we don't count cheating the system, you gotta pay. They have to make money to pay their employees somehow, at least the Sun gives you an alternate option.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Give me all the ads you want but at least give me the option whether they're personalised or not... Why is this now a paid choice? The companies get paid by the advertisers either way, right? I'm not expecting it for free but I don't like thousands of unknown companies tracking me thank you very much.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

They get paid more by the advertisers for delivering personalized ads.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago

Of course they do :/... Surely though, even with the previous free choice of general or personalised ads, I bet a decent few people still habitually clicked 'accept all', so I can't imagine this making that much of a difference financially... And this way they'll probably drive away some more privacy-savvy readers as well. Oh well, guess they wouldn't be doing it if it didn't pay off for them.

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