this post was submitted on 20 Jun 2024
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Moritz Körner, Member of the European Parliament, disclosed the decision on Twitter. Swedish publisher SVG said, “The question was removed at the last moment from Thursday’s ambassadorial meeting in Brussels”.

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[–] [email protected] 203 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

They are just edging this bill till nobody pays attention. Democracy at work!

[–] [email protected] 67 points 4 months ago

Indeed, until the next time, where it doesn't have enough news coverage. China 2.0 here we come.

[–] [email protected] 141 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I’m still fucking mad the Left voted yes for this. Campaigning on a no and then turning their coats immediately after the elections. Disgraceful, and I hope whichever party members are responsible get booted.

[–] [email protected] 62 points 4 months ago (11 children)

Don't make the mistake of thinking that left mean anti-authoritarian. Left or right is an economic stance, and is orthogonal to beliefs surrounding government rights Vs population rights.

[–] [email protected] 36 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

When I say Left, I mean Vänsterpartiet, not some nebulous coalition. See their stance here.

Chat control was a proposal on an EU level which meant that applications and social media platforms would be forced to scan all of their users messages. The proposal has been put forth by the EU comission as a part of a larger package with the purpose of protecting children against exploitation on the internet. The Left Party considers that the part specifically about chat control wouldn't contribute to the end goals. There are more effective measures that need to be taken in order to protect children.

After significant criticism from us and many others the EU parliament has significantly improved the proposal. They have among other things removed all parts regarding automatic scanning. This has meant that all parties now are in support of the EU-parliament position. The proposal is now on hold among the member states and instead another, temporary law has been extended to counter sexual abuse of children on the internet.

Overall the Left (Vänsterpartiet) campaigns on a position of being against surveillance and the like. The Social Democrats (part of the Left coalition) however is in favour of it, because of course they fucking are. My issue here is obviously that they're lying to our faces.

On a much greater scale I have a lot of issues. For the most part I align mostly with V and MP, but we're talking on a level of like 60-70%, so they don't actually represent my views particularly well. In the grand scheme of things that's also not something I'd expect; I'm rather extreme but I also realise that there's only so much we can do when operating within the system we currently have. Thus I align with the parties that align the closest with the core beliefs I have, V and MP.

One of my biggest icks when it comes to politics is hiding behind children. It infuriates me because it's never genuine. It's never about the fucking children, they're just a convenient excuse because the moment someone criticises a suggestion, you can turn around and say "Oh so you hate children? Are you a paedophile? Why do you support children being harmed?"

[–] [email protected] 14 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Left or right is an economic stance

What about the social stance?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago

Also that. But I'd say that wewbull's point stands that there are more and less authoritarian flavours of that too

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Check out the political compass, which is an interesting way to conceptualize political leanings. I don't think the test is particularly good (I have issues with a few of the questions), but the answer I get is pretty close to where I think I should be placed, so maybe there's some merit to it.

I'm consistently in the bottom half near the center line, and the two major parties in my country are in the top right. I guess that just demonstrates why I fail to see much difference in what I care about in the two major parties, since moving toward either direction is a move away from me.

Anyway, I hope this is a decent demonstration of how the left/right divide doesn't tell the whole story.

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[–] [email protected] 114 points 4 months ago (3 children)

They are just delaying the vote for another time... Hoping that next time it will fly under the radar and there won't be a huge backlash of discontent.

If the vote fail, they just wait a year, rename it, and try again.

Same thing happens in the US. Law proposed that people hate, people organize, start a campaign that fights for news airtime, bringing awareness of the dickery about to happen, and then succeed after a hard battle and many many volunteer hours spent.

In 6 months Congress just renames it the "I love kittens" act and sticks it on a must pass bill.

Fighting bullshit laws is exhausting....

[–] [email protected] 24 points 4 months ago (3 children)

Don't be surprise if it reappears as an attachment to a fishing quota law or a law defining sizes for underwear...

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 4 months ago (2 children)

It happens in the US yes, but does it happen in the EU?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 4 months ago

Idk about the EU(there have been cases that were exactly this, an example would be Article 13), but I can say to you, that this devinetively happens in Germany. Our conservatives party wants to pass a law, that would track and save all your online activity(Vorratsdatenspeicherung/ data preservation) to fight "paedophiles and terrorists" they bring it up once in a while, even tho, our federal court already said, that its illegal.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 4 months ago (3 children)

As much I like the EU, politicians are politicians ...

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[–] [email protected] 93 points 4 months ago (4 children)

Wasn't this rejected once already? Perhaps if they wanted to do something useful, they should pass something that says that if something is majority disliked twice or something, then it should be withdrawn and not proposed again for at least 100 years.

[–] [email protected] 95 points 4 months ago (3 children)

They will keep trying again and again and again. The assault on privacy has been going on for decades and it will never stop.

[–] [email protected] 73 points 4 months ago (2 children)

You've gotta defend for an infinite amount of time, but they've only gotta succeed once.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 4 months ago (15 children)

Yep, and as I pointed out in another comment in this thread, Chat Control isn't the only piece of legislation like this that's in the works.

Considering that the extreme right just won big, I have no doubt that one of these fascist surveillance packages will go through. Yeah, at first it may be used for catching criminals, until it isn't

[–] [email protected] 29 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Nono, it will always only be used to catch criminals, that won't change...it's what makes someone a criminal that changes.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 4 months ago

And "Chat Control" isn't even the only thing like this in the pipeline. There's the so-called "security by design" bullshit (which does the opposite of what then name implies) that's actually even worse than Chat Control and has also been worked on in secret, and which'd include mass scale surveillance of not just photos but pretty much everything, and is much more likely to pass than Chat Control.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Such a rule is basically un-enforceable. Because it is nearly never exactly the same text. So it is always the first time voted on.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

What they could do is create a law that protects the integrity of E2EE. At least in this case.

But I guess that will never happen... Well, a girl can dream.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 4 months ago (1 children)

It was protected by the ECHR in a recent ruling. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2024/03/european-court-human-rights-confirms-undermining-encryption-violates-fundamental

However, Chat Control 2.0 argues that since the spying is done before the content is encrypted, it's somehow ok. 🙄

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Either way they can just give it a new name and change some details to propose it again. Like how they made it "voluntary" this time (but you can only send text if you don't agree).

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[–] [email protected] 79 points 4 months ago (4 children)

Find the politicians by name who voted yes for this, and display them in public.

Let the capable open source community then take over going through their phones, since they must be OK with their phones being scanned, right?

[–] [email protected] 22 points 4 months ago (1 children)

At least some of them were discussion giving themselves an exception from it. So no.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago (7 children)

All the more reason to find the friendly neighbourhood blackhat gang

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[–] [email protected] 72 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Note the vote was withdrawn, not actually voted against. They're pushing this for a later date because there was no majority.

“The EU Council did not make a decision on chat control today, as the agenda item was removed due to the lack of a majority, (...)

Belgium’s draft law, (...) was instead postponed indefinitely. (...) Belgium cannot currently present a proposal that would gain a majority. In July, the Council Presidency will transfer from Belgium to Hungary, which has stated its intention to advance negotiations on chat control as part of its work program.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Absolutely fuck all is going to get done while orban has control of the council so at least theres that

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[–] [email protected] 67 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Can we please identify the guys always pushing encryption-breaking ideas?

[–] [email protected] 42 points 4 months ago (2 children)

And hack their phones so we can see why they want to spy on everyone else's phones

[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I have zero doubt that many core proponents of anti-privacy laws are pedophiles — that's why they always add measures to ensure it's illegal to invade their own privacy.

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[–] fuzzy_feeling 17 points 4 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 14 points 4 months ago

I hate dishonest titles and URLs. In reality, this shit has nothing to do with "child sex content."

[–] [email protected] 51 points 4 months ago

So I assume that since it was withdrawn, this doesn't set a precedent and it's only a matter of time untill they try to sneak it thru with a different name.

[–] [email protected] 47 points 4 months ago

Now put in a law saying you can't do that

[–] [email protected] 40 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Nice. I guess they didn't expect to get a majority to support it anymore. Definitely a win for now, but I'm sure they'll try again.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 4 months ago

I guess that realisation came after Germany said they will vote "No"

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[–] [email protected] 35 points 4 months ago

Damn.. this was almost China 2.0 in EU. This was a close call people... this is not good.

[–] [email protected] 33 points 4 months ago

Lets gooooo🔥

(It has happened in the past, it will probably happen again in a few months, but still, its a win!)

[–] [email protected] 28 points 4 months ago

Thank the heavens. Now keep it that way!

[–] [email protected] 21 points 4 months ago

Great choice, now do not say the same thing next year!

[–] [email protected] 20 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I am suspicious they realized that they weren’t going to be able to make a loophole for themselves - I’ve seen several articles in the last week on how they were trying to do that.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Nah it's more like that got caught being hypocrites

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago

Crazy to think they were even considering it. Hopefully this is the end of it.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 months ago

From what I understand it was withdrawn as a vote „in favor of the goals of the commission“ was not guaranteed. In part because Germany announced its decision to withdraw support yesterday. Seems to be standard behavior.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

Until next try in a few months.

What i read here sometime without source, that secret services since Snowden push for breaking of encryption, seems more and more plausible.

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