this post was submitted on 23 Oct 2023
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I certainly have problems with the way current financial institutions operate, but prior to the credit score there wasn't a standardized, scientific way to assess lending risk. It was left to a good ol' boy process rife with racism, classism, and sexism. Sadly, we're better off with what we have now, as flawed as it is.
There still isn't a standardized and scientific way to assess credit risk. There are three major companies, several minor ones, and all of them offer multiple products.
IT'S ALL A FUCKING SCAM. We just blindly accept random institutions compiling all of our data and telling a bank whether or not we should be given a loan regardless of our ability to pay it back. It has little to do with income anymore, which should be the only allowable metric. Don't want the risk? Get the fuck out of the mortgage business.
It was so much better before! When being a woman, or god forbid, being black, counted as serious criteria. Oh, and you best be friends with the banker. (Read the part, again, about being a white man, who was well accepted in the community.)
It's not a scam, it's a step forward. Time to take the next step.
How do you know that those aren't factored in still?
Because there are standard metrics for where the score comes from. Each of the big three has slightly different weighting, but it all broadly comes out the same.
The numbers aren't made up. You can look at your credit report and see what is affecting it.
No you can't. When you look at your credit report you see a lot of "MAY" and "COULD" and "MIGHT."
This is horseshit.
Yep it's not a mystery at all if you care enough to read about it. All these "capitalist dystopia" complainers sound like what I probably thought about credit scores when I was in my early 20s and had terrible credit from being irresponsible with credit cards. My credit score is 800 now because I simply pay my bills on time and have an established history of doing so.
Yeah, it's not a perfect system and I would welcome increased federal oversight and greater transparency because it does have the potential for abuse.
That said, it's not numbers made up to keep the little guy down. Lenders want to lend money because they make money off it. The whole point is to determine whether or not you're a safe investment.
We could have a discussion on the merits of modern usury, which can be deeply predatory and abusive. It's not the credit score that's the problem.
The numbers are made up, unless you can actually prove your original statement.
Edit: oh, and since proving a negative is essentially impossible, you can't actually prove your original statement, so I would recommend not making statements like that, and try to rephrase.
You think the people that scream about credit scores have ever looked at and analyzed their credit report lol
Yes, you brown-nosing corpo-slurping bootlicking twit, I do in fact keep a pretty damn close watch on my credit score because suckups like you will fellate and propagate any capitalist horseshit you can so I have to rather than just NOT WORRYING ABOUT IT and only applying for lines of credit in line with my income levels.
Instead it becomes this stupid game of laddering where you can apply for an increase now, but you can't apply for new credit, but also you need a new loan to maximize your score, no not that kind of loan, no also don't pay off the loan that's bad too, why did you need more credit again?
Anyone ignorant enough to support this needs their own separate financial system that caters to their intrinsic need to be a sub.
Literally nobody is making you apply for lines of credit outside your income levels… that’s entirely on you.
There’s no game to play. You take out credit, you pay it back. You have revolving credit, you pay the balance every month and don’t carry debt. It’s literally that simple.
I have never had to apply for an increase in credit limits, pay your bills and banks/credit card companies will just do it automatically.
It’s really not hard in the least.
So you've never had an emergency or a need for a large one-time purchase. Good for you. You are not everyone. The sooner you learn and understand that people that aren't you exist, the sooner you can graduate high school.
Are you arguing that the system is made up or that it's unfair to the poor?
I would agree with the latter, but you haven't been terribly consistent in your argument. I've had troubles with my credit score in the past, which is part of why I understand how it works.
I agree that credit scores unfairly disadvantage the poor, but that's merely a reflection of deeper economic issues that should be dealt with. Abolishing the credit score won't enable the poor to suddenly buy houses.
Yes, I have indeed lol. I had a year where our hvac went out and our son second child’s birth bill which racked up thousands that we had to pay out of pocket. We had tens of thousands in unexpected bills that year.
We had to drain most of our savings and take out a large loan to cover it all. Guess what I did. Paid the damn loan back.
Seriously? You think draining your savings is the same as not having any money, lol. You are a wee bit out of touch. Born on 3rd base and expects everyone up to bat should get a home run.
Lmao dude I was born to white trash drug addicts and never lived in one place for more than 9 months because they could never afford rent and kept getting kicked out. I have lived on my own since I was 15
Born on third base my ASS. I have worked my ass off since I was a teenager. I’ve lived in friends storm cellars, couches, and my truck at times to get where I’m at now.
I made saving a priority since my first job working at fuckin Burger King in high school.
So you had friends that helped you live at their place, do you think that maybe there people who don't have that kind of support system? You did not pull yourself up by your bootstraps, you had a lot of help along the way.
Also, now go tell the you that was living in your truck to take from your savings and pay your bills.
Jesus dude yeah people have had it worse but it's not a competition. You accused him of not earning his financial position and he explained how your attack on person is baseless. Having friends is a support system, it doesn't mean you had it easy. If you were not raised by wolves, you've had people help you too.
Whatever you say dude. I know I had help. Virtually everyone has help along the way. If you have literally nobody that will let you crash on your couch, maybe you should look deep inside why nobody likes you.
Me living in my truck did take from my savings to pay bills. Half the reason I lived in my truck was not to be wasting money on renting some shitty apartment and draining my savings. I maintained a savings the whole time.
Keep complaining instead of doing something about it. It’ll guarantee you stay poor.
How about when you left the house to live on your friend's couch? You had savings then? Did you pay your friends rent? LMAO, How much was your savings, $10? Did you have it in a bank account at 15? So many questions that I think you're having battles with your inner self answering. I normally don't like to see this kind of struggle, but this time I'm enjoying it.
When I left the house? You mean when my parents drug habits caught up with them and we ended up homeless.
I didn’t live on anyone’s couch. I spent a day or two at most at a friends house at a time.
I had a few thousand saved up. And yes had a bank account where my pay was direct deposited or my parents would steal it.
You can wallow in your self pity and tell yourself that everything is luck or some bullshit to get out of helping yourself. That’s fine. I’m doing more than well now lol.
Welcome to living on someone's couch, lmao.
What's super hilarious is that you think I'm poor. Just because I have compassion for people doesn't mean I don't have money. Your world view is fucked up if you think being shitty to people who are in a hard place, a place you've actually been, is a decent way to go.
Why do you think that was one friend or something? That’s not living on someone’s couch.
And I have plenty of compassion for people actually trying to make their lives better. I have zero compassion for people that sit there and just blame everyone else, thinking they should get everything handed to them.
Would you be this toxic if you had help when you were younger instead of left to fend for yourself? I honestly don't get your world view, it's honestly depressing. Lazy seeming to you may be someone in shock and not knowing what to do because they're overwhelmed. Why would you not want help for others that you didn't get? It didn't make you stronger, it made you hard and judgemental for some reason. I'm glad you got out but damn if you're not pulling up the ladder behind you.
I haven’t been toxic. Toxic is the prevailing attitude online, at least on Lemmy, that nobody should have to work for anything and everything should just be free, never mind that someone has to actually work to make that shit they want for free.
Toxic is the attitude that anyone who isn’t working at a minimum wage job subsisting on ramen just lucked into it without any work at all
I am all for helping people. I have personally helped a ton of people that have needed it. I’ve given my couch, my truck, money, food, stuck my neck out for people for jobs, clothes, you name it. I love lifting people I care about up. What I hate is trying to help someone that just leeches off of others and gets mad when you cut off the help. And I’ve been around enough to see that most people complaining online are that person.
How would you know that and who made you judge and jury? Wouldn't you want to help a few too many people with some who may not need it, than not helping enough? Good luck man, you seem resentful that others aren't having to suffer instead of being happy they got out. As far as complaining, all I see is people like you complaining that people don't want to work. I think this is my last comment, have a good weekend.
Just because it was worse before, doesn't mean we can't also make the NOW better, again.
im being unfair of course, unlike modern credit scores tossing a virgin into the volcano doesnt still put minorities at a disadvantage
Why? Income is a terrible metric. Regardless of how much money I've made, I've always spent within my means. I've never carried debt, but always has my cc to build the credit score.
The idea that some bozo who spends more than he earns has a better credit score than me just because he makes more money makes absolutely zero sense to me.
I suggest you lie on a few credit applications (not really). You'll be amazed at how readily you get approved just because your income crosses a certain threshold, even with the same score.
Several years ago I was looking to add a couple of cards, primarily for emergency reasons. I apply for a card and get rejected. Six months later I get a new job that's promising me a significantly higher income but I haven't started receiving more money yet (contract work is fun). I apply for the same card, same information, knowing my credit score had not changed, the only difference in my applications was my income (that required no verification) and that time I got approved.
So apparently the banks have a different thought process than you.
And what the fuck is wrong with you that you even think about someone else's credit score? Are you also mad that your neighbor is gay?
Don't answer that...
I never said it wasn't a factor, only a terrible one that shouldnt be the only one. Also try improving your credit score and see the better rates and cards with better benefits open up to you.
Considering you think I spend time thinking about people's credit score because I think it's better metric for getting credit, this question is all but a straight up admission that you spend a lot of mental energy thinking about the income of other people.
Are you mad that your neighbor is straight too?
What about those that have sufficient income, but don't pay their bills and have defaulted on previous loans?
Mortgages were, prior to assholes screwing the whole thing up with mortgage-backed securities, seen as one of the lowest risk things banks could handle.
If you default on a mortgage the bank forecloses and auctions the home. This was QUITE rare before the housing crash. The problem was that the banking industry became so lax that they were giving loans to people that actually did NOT have the money to pay for them, figuring that they could just seize and sell the home as they always had. The problem THEN is that mortgage-backed securities were a thing by that point and every foreclosure caused another domino to fall over.
It became a shitshow because banks fucked themselves over being greedy pieces of shit.
Found the 550 guy lol
About 780 last I looked. Utilization went up when I decided to do some travel this year. But go on thinking that the only people that want a system reformed are the ones that don't know how to work it.
I'm sure that'll get you far in life. All the way to brown-nosing middle management.
This is the internet. I, along with everyone else here, don’t give two shits about your score or opinion bud.
And yet your cunt ass cares enough to post.
So you're a hypocritical cunt, not just a normal cunt.
If it was a publicly available algorithim, then Id believe you. But it ain't, so I'm suspicious.
We don't know the algorithms specifically, but we have enough information to have a pretty good idea how it works.
It's better than what it was. High time to take another look, but it's far, far better.
It seems to me it doesn't count risk. It counts profitability. It's why it drops when people pay their loans early.
Neither is it now. You forgot the 'hidden from public' part.
They tell u what affects your score right on the credit report! Hahaha What the fuck are u clowns talking about.
And now it's time to nix what we have for something better, just like we did before.
Why would you be better off? In the rest of the world you just have to provide proof of income and proof of savings and debt and banks can calculate how much they are willing to loan you for the purchase of a house. Seems to work fine, and I don't have to have pay interest on meaningless loans just to prove that I can.
The problem is that just having the income and savings doesn't necessarily guarantee that you'll be as good about paying back a loan as someone of your same income and savings.
That's supposed to be where the credit score helps, but the current system is so shady that it basically just reads as the ol' boys club system but asking pretty please to pretend there's a formula and method being used.
I think there are plenty of failsafe mechanisms. But most importantly, if you fail to pay your mortgage, the bank has the right to take possession of your house. Those forces the bank to do it's due diligence with regards to the value of the house. Also, if a bank has been too lenient with its mortgages, it can get into serious trouble - the government here enforces pretty strict rules to prevent people from getting in over their heads.
If you don’t take credit facilities but pay for your expenses in cash, you are considered a risk. Credit scoring based on credit card purchases is akin to being required to be spied on every step of the way just so you can access what you practically can without the credit in the first place. I don’t have a problem with people who are fine with that kind of behavior. But there should be a way of fair assessment even if you pay in cash.
Yeah. It's really changed a lot...