this post was submitted on 19 Aug 2023
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[–] [email protected] 98 points 1 year ago (3 children)

So long as everyone involved consents sans coercion, I do not see why anyone else should care/be involved

[–] [email protected] 46 points 1 year ago

This is pretty much my view on people's sexuality generally.

I don't care who's doing what to who as long as everyone involved is a consenting adult.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Does getting paid still counts as "sans coercion" though ?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Do you really feel like you’re coercing a waitress when you tip?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

This is an interesting analogy. I do get the sense that many waitresses and waiters hate their job, and do it because of lack of other options. However I do feel that by using their services and paying them, I'm helping them. They've made this choice, under a certain amount of coercion from the circumstances and system (which most of us suffer from to some degree, working because we have to), but my helping them get paid is helping them. I do find it important to be nice to them and treat them as real people, even moreso than people with whom my interaction is on a more equal footing.

However there is nuance here in matters of degree. I think I can tell when a place treats their staff well or shittily--it tends to slow in their attitude. I prefer not to patronize a place when I get that shitty vibe.

It's interesting to think about how this translates to sex work. If I used such services, I would want to feel like the person I paid somewhat enjoyed her job.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Does waiting tables and having sex with strangers feel similar to you? These jobs aren’t comparable from a psychological standpoint. I never heard that it’s common for waiters to be substance users or have PTSD.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Weirdly enough, restaurant workers are some of the highest substance users group. A Google search on this subject is quite surprising.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago

It's not even close to sex workers which have the highest amount of substance abuse among all professions.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I suppose it depends on how desperate someone is for money. I am in an industry where client relationships are important, but more money will not make my hard no a yes

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Indeed, as I clarified under another comment

Tbh I know little about the topic and was under the (maybe wrong) impression than many sex workers are poor people that need to do it to survive. But then I guess the issue I was pointing is more about our capitalist society than about sex work

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

That I cannot say, and seeing as in the vast majority of the US it is illegal, all we have is supposition unfortunately

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Labor as coerced selling of one’s body is an interesting view.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

That's literally all work in capitalism. You use your time and body to do things for other people in exchange for money. We're all prostitutes, only a few of us have sex for it.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Negotiating a price is not itself coercion.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

All work is exloitation, sexual work is sexual exploitation. Its not exactly consent if the other option is being homeless or starving.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

That's trie if any work, as you're saying. But then why would it be more of a problem with sex work than with any other work?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Do you feel like any other work is the same as sex work? For example does flippping burgers the same to you as having to have sex with a stranger?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago

What it is to me is different from what it should be. Why should it be different? You sell your body ability to provide a service.

The difference lies in the intimacy associated with sex. But then how different is it from therapy? It is physical intimacy. It is the only difference.

There is no more strain on your body than with many physical work, less actually than construction or many other work. There is no more strain on psychology than care works like therapy or nurses. Quite less actually.

The actual problem of sex work is exploitation: people are forced into this work, and this is extremely bad. This breaks a fundamental contract of liberalism. But it wouldn't be as bad if it was legal and monitored.

Thus, the problem is Christian puritanism. Sex is bad in itself in this philosophy.

Ask yourself this question : why is a woman earning money on onlyfan a bad thing, but a man earning money surveying a beach in swimsuit is perfectly fine? Actually a woman can do this too!

It's not a matter of how much skin you show or even how intimate you can be, otherwise massage or therapy wouldn't be good. It is a matter of sex and how to control it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Religion/Bible thumper made it more of a problem.