this post was submitted on 31 Dec 2023
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Costco workers in Norfolk have unionised and Costco are seething.

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[–] [email protected] 223 points 10 months ago (13 children)

I'm super pro-union, and strongly support the unionization of the Norfolk workers, but I should acknowledge that this looks like a pretty reasonable response from Costco that's far cry from the whiny, hostile, threatening responses we're seeing from the likes of Amazon and Tesla. (absent any other information about the situation).

If you don't want your employees to unionise, you should give them great conditions, minimising the benefit of unionization, then not sook about it if they unionize anyway - which is exactly what appears to be happening here.

That said, I'm open to being corrected.

[–] [email protected] 54 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I only know marginally more but I think you're right.

Costco is known for being a good corporate citizen to its members and employees.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Sure it sounds reasonable because if they took the mask off there would be an epidemic of other stores realizing they need to unionize too. It doesn't matter how disarming upper management acts because ultimately the role of the capitalist to employees is that of an oppressor. At least with a union you have a VERY limited means of pushing back against that dynamic.

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[–] [email protected] 191 points 10 months ago (31 children)

This doesn't read like seething to me.

Like, it's great that people are unionizing, because even if there's the best possible relationship between businesses and labor, the union still makes that relationship more equitable.
But that doesn't mean that the creation of the union has to be viewed as hostility between labor and business.

I'll be interested to see if their good reputation holds up to pressure,but as of right now I haven't heard anything that makes me want disbelieve their statement.

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[–] [email protected] 176 points 10 months ago (6 children)

I feel Ike most people don't realize how Costco workers are treated which is important context for this letter. Costco literally looks like a union job on its surface, good pay, full benefits, good time off accrual rates. Like yeah i understand what the letter is saying. They already treat their workers as good as most unions are able to negotiate, I'd feel a little upset about it too if i was in that leadership. Not because they joined a union but because they felt like they needed to. Would make me wonder if there were poor conditions i wasn't aware of.

[–] [email protected] 125 points 10 months ago (1 children)

They couldn’t have worded this letter any better. It puts the responsibility on them (leadership) it says they did not think it was necessary but obviously they have some blind spots. It acknowledges the value of unions, and in no way demonizes them or the employees.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Welcome to Costco we love you.

-Honestly that's the most direct corporate statement I've seen so far, it feels real.

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Costco does have that ethos, but it's still essentially a benevolent dictatorship without the power dynamic of a union

[–] [email protected] 16 points 10 months ago (9 children)

It’s also a bit of a farce, Costco hide behind their ethos while handing out no more than 3% raises a year and that’s for exceptional work. They just paid out a dividend to shareholders too

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Nah, this time is exactly the right time to unionize. This way the company does not have to fight the Union and they can cooperate properly.

However, if under new management the company where to ever change her tune..........

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago

It does put it into perspective. Call me cynical or realistic, but something in me saw this as a nice trap for union-considerers. "Just talk about how you feel with your manager" -> at will fired.

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[–] [email protected] 94 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I think this is a classy response. I'd love to see more about the fight if one took place .

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

It definitely is, but taking their statement at face value, I still don't think they should feel bad. The only way to find out what your employees want and need is for them to unionize. Unless labor is organized on its own terms, labor cannot really express itself to corporate leadership. And not everything workers want or need is selfish; believe it or not, most workers are proud of the work they do, and want the company to thrive for everyone - ownership, management, labor, customers, environment. Ownership only thinks of ownership, management only exists to enforce ownership dictates. A fuller picture which includes the rest will result in a strong and stable business that has a long, long future.

Unions are good for everyone.

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[–] [email protected] 68 points 10 months ago

The best any Capitalist firm can offer to its employees is a "benevolent" dictatorship. Unions provide an actual change to the underlying power dynamic, which is why capitalist firms oppose them so much.

Super happy for the workers in Norfolk, let's keep this kind of collective action rolling forward!

[–] [email protected] 67 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Echoing others, Costco is a solid employer and I actually believe their sentiment.

HOWEVER

The difference between union and non-union is the difference between asking your employer pretty please to treat you well and telling your employer how you will accept being treated.

Even if the union yields no improvements whatsoever for the workers, it's worth it just to have that express and clear leveling of the playing field.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago (4 children)

Hey, serious question here, I own a small business with 8 employees. All profits for the business go back to employee bonuses / incentives. I pay myself $1/year and $0 in profit distributions. We cover medical benefits.

It seems like the sentiment amongst Lemmy is to unionize the employees, which I'm fine with, but am I allowed to pay their union dues?

My only qualm is it means less profit sharing for them, but if it improves morale to have that representation, I'm all for it. Ultimately, it is what they want.

I'm union dumb. I want to do right by the employees. But I also don't want to get screwed to their detriment (e.g. Personnel Concepts, fuck that company).

In before anyone asks, I work contract gigs in a completely separate industry to pay my own bills. I own this business to create jobs and be part of the community.

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[–] [email protected] 59 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Idk how you read that letter and interpret it as "seething". I read nothing of the sort.

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[–] [email protected] 56 points 10 months ago

I understand where the Costco management is coming from, since I've heard they do, in fact, strive in putting their employees with great pay and benefits. But they got to realize that employees need to unionize so that their good pay and benefits continue in the future. There are no guarantees that Costco will continue to do so unless they have unions.

[–] [email protected] 44 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

People credulously taking corporate speak at face value. You have to understand that this letter was crafted by a committee that included whichever anti-union consulting firms they have on retainer. The persona that a corporation projects is created and maintained by its public relations machine. It’s Edward Bernays-level propaganda to manipulate their employees, their customers, the government, and the public.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 10 months ago
[–] [email protected] 40 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Based on what I've heard about Costco, they're literally the only company that I could read this letter and think "yeah, they're probably genuine about their sentiment".

Unionizing is ALWAYS a good idea, just in case, but as far as companies go, Costco has always gone out of its way to make sure their people are taken care of.

https://ethicsunwrapped.utexas.edu/case-study/the-costco-model

The above is a study from the University of Texas. The conclusion seems to be that yes...it's still retail, with all the usual crap that comes with it, but the company actually tries to mitigate it as much as possible.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 10 months ago (2 children)

For real. The kicker for me is that I recognize almost every worker at my local Costco. They aren't just new faces every week. I worked retail for years and I've never seen a retail place retain so many people for so long.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I'm a retail manager and I would love to be a manager for Costco.

Half my stress comes from trying to fight head office on behalf of my staff while being the guy that gets yelled at by both sides.

Managers aren't all on the companies side. We're just stuck in the middle.

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[–] [email protected] 36 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Costco has a reputation for treating workers well and compensating fairly, union or not.

That said, it's still great news for those workers as they have greater assurance and say on their working conditions and no longer need to rely on the goodwill of Costco's management because who knows if or when financial headwinds will change their practices.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 10 months ago

I'm quite surprised because it's been one of the things the company has been proud of for a long time, offering conditions so good that people didn't feel the need to unionize as they felt they were treated fairly... As someone else said it really just looks like an honest answer...

[–] [email protected] 18 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (8 children)

I used to work at Costco, although only for a summer.

Every time I shared my experience working at Costco to friends and family, they were quick to jump to Costco's defense, as if I was insulting a dead relative. Countless times, if not every single time, I heard "it's probably only the Costco you worked at".

For comparison, I also worked at Walmart, and my experience there was neutral, but I've had some people try to dig for bad experiences. There were some bad experiences, but at the end of the day, when I clocked out, I was done working (unlike Costco).

Don't put too much trust into these corporations.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago

I think experiences like yours really is what is covered in Costco management's disappointment in this letter.

The Teamsters got an excellent national agreement raising wage standards across the organization, and makes it seem Costco hasn't kept up. On the other hand, the odd pressure tactic, bit of favoritism, or dirty trick store managers pull get people motivated to join unions as well.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago

at the end of the day, when I clocked out, I was done working (unlike Costco).

Could you expand on this a little, please? Were they expecting you to work off the clock, were they calling you at home for some reason, were they expecting you to keep open availability?

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 10 months ago

Yeah, Costco has always been hated by Wall Street for how well it treats its workers, and how well they're compensated. They're always dinged for being able to send more profits to shareholders than they do, because they treat their workers too well.

They are pretty much the only large company that would send a letter like this that I would believe. Good for Norfolk, but no one should lump Costco in with, say, Walmart, as far as big box retailers go. They really do cleave to a higher ethical standard.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Just last night I watched the season 1 finale to Superstore and the "joke" message they were making was exactly what this letter is saying. Seriously guys you don't need a union because we care! 🤣

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 10 months ago

As others in this thread have stated, Costco is probably the only big company whose word I'd trust on this letter. Never heard anything bad about them and I genuinely believe their continued success is hedged entirely on their relationship with customers and employees.

But the "if you don't feel like we care enough, talk to a manager" always sounds bad because if lower management is the issue then that's a non-answer. Would be better to have a "reach out anonymously at this inbox" or something, otherwise they may as well tell it to the union rep.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 10 months ago

Good. I know some people who work at Costco and they tell me that the work has been pure bullshit, overworked and constantly understaffed, hopefully this gets picked up and more Costcos unionize

[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

We're not anti-union, but...

[–] [email protected] 12 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I mean, if working for Costco is anything like what I've heard I wouldn't expect the union to change very much. Even if things are good there I think unionizing is a good idea to make sure it stays that way. Or maybe this specific location had some problems?

Anyway, seems like a pretty tame letter and of course they have to say something about it. But I support whatever the workers decide to do next.

Sincerely, Some uninformed speculative internet commenter.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago

Well, now there's collective bargaining to ensure employees are treated fairly. You don't join a union for the good times, you join it during the good times to help in the bad times.

Time will tell if management stands behind what they've said in this letter. I hope it does, but greed is greed and I don't survive on hope.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Unions are, to employers, what HR is to employees.

If employers need to have HR, it's only natural that employees must have a union

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (3 children)

If the union won’t make things better for your employees, then it won’t make anything worse for you, either.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago

Good news. Let's see it accelerate and expand to other stores and competitors

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (1 children)

When I was working at Costco I was told that the reason Costco has better benefits than most places is they just match the union contracts in order to avoid further unionization. And I gotta say it works pretty well, I tried bringing up starting/joining a union while I was there and most people just didn't want to rock the boat and risk losing what they were getting already.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago (3 children)

when are they doing Walmart

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