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Ignorance or enlightenment? (startrek.website)

submitted 11 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Okay so you’re either a troll or just an idiot. Given you keep trying to make me out to be an antisemite because that’s the standard, and frankly only, zionist shill tactic I’m going to with the former.

I never called you an antisemite, and I'd prefer it if you didn't call me names like "troll", "idiot" or "shill" either.

But just in case you are just an idiot: all of Israel is stolen land, its a country founded by Jewish colonists that unilaterally declared independence. Every single Israeli is a coloniser and Palestinians calling for their stolen land to be given or taken back are no worse than Indians who wanted their freedom from the British.

That is a very lopsided reading of the history of how the state of Israel came to be. There is a lot more nuance to that story, and I'd advise you to dig a bit deeper into it so that you can free yourself from the prejudices and dogma that you've become a victim to. /u/[email protected] 's comment below is a good start.

But even if your story were completely true, your argument still ignores the fact that the majority of those 7 million jews who are living there right now are 2nd, 3rd, or 4th generation immigrants who had nothing to do with that story other than being born in Israel. Any "from the river to the sea" solution will have to involve forcibly getting rid of them. There is no way to do that without committing genocide against those people.

[–] [email protected] -2 points 11 months ago

Just because you inferred it rather than outright saying it, does not mean the accusation didn't happen. Which is another tactic commonly used by trolls, so I'm now pretty sure you're just being a dickhead for your own entertainment and don't actually give a shit about this situation. Further proof of this is the classic: "what you said is wrong. I'm not going to tell how its wrong or whT the 'right' version is, just go do more research, lol" and I'm willing to bet I've read more accounts of the history of this conflict from both sides involved and external 3rd parties than you have.

And that's classic colonialist apologism, "well they had kids here so the land belongs to them now." Like should we consider the Russian invasion of Ukraine. There will have been thousands of Russians born in occupied Crimea by now. Does that mean that land belongs to Russia? Is invading a country completely acceptable as long as you hold on to it long enough for someone to have a kid?

But yes, decolonisation does require the removal of the colonising party. If they can't return to their country of origin or their parents/grandparents country of origin, then they will need to legally immigrate/become citizens of Palestine. Its the same thing that's happened in literally every case of decolonisation, leave or integrate into the new free state. It's just given how Israel has treated the Palestinians I can't imagine many Jews would want to be part of Palestine and face those consequences.