this post was submitted on 08 Nov 2023
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Antiwork

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A community for those who want to end work, are curious about ending work, want to get the most out of a work-free life, want more information on anti-work ideas and want personal help with their own jobs/work-related struggles.

The new place for c/[email protected]

This server is no longer working, and we had to move.

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Subscribers: 2.1k

Date Created: June 21, 2023

Library copied from reddit:
The Anti-Work Library 📚
Essential Reads

Start here! These are probably the most talked-about essays on the topic.

c/Antiwork Rules

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1. Server Main Rules

The main rules of the server will be enforced stringently. https://lemmy.world/

2. No spam or reposts + limit off topic comments

Spamming posts will be removed. Reposts will be removed with the exception of a repost becoming the main hub for discussion on that topic.

Off topic comments that do not pertain to the post at hand may be removed if it is deemed they contribute nothing and/or foster hostility at users. This mostly applies to political and religious debate, but can be applied to other things at the mod’s discretion.

3. Post must have Antiwork/ Work Reform explicitly involved

Post must have Antiwork/Work Reform explicitly involved in some capacity. This can be talking about antiwork, work reform, laws, and ext.

4. Educate don’t attack

No mocking, demeaning, flamebaiting, purposeful antagonizing, trolling, hateful language, false accusation or allegation, or backseat moderating is allowed. Don’t resort to ad hominem attacks against another user or insult other people, examples of violations would be going after the person rather than the stance they take.

If we feel the comment is uncalled for we will remove it. Stay civil and there won’t be problems.

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Under no circumstance are you allowed to promote or advertise any product or service

6. No factually misleading informationContent that makes claims or implications that can be proven false or misleading will be removed.

7. Headlines

If the title of the post isn’t an original title of the article then the first thing in the body of the post should be an original title written in this format “Original title: {title here}”.

8. Staff Discretion

Staff can take disciplinary action on offenses not listed in the rules when a community member's actions or general conduct creates a negative experience for another player and/or the community.

It is impossible to list every example or variation of the rules. It is also impossible to word everything perfectly. Players are expected to understand the intent of the rules and not attempt to "toe the line" or use loopholes to get around the intent of the rule.


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[–] [email protected] 168 points 1 year ago (5 children)

I'm confused, does he actually think a box packer is skilled labor or is this just a whoosh from the girl.

[–] [email protected] 106 points 1 year ago (34 children)

Warehouse fulfillment is skilled labor. Fast food work is skilled labor. I'm having a hard time thinking of an example of a truly unskilled labor job.

[–] [email protected] 84 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Skilled labor is economists jargon, so the meaning of it does not match the dictionary definition.

No one is saying there is literally no skill involved in unskilled labor.

[–] [email protected] 60 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Skilled labor = real human deserving of a fair wage.

Unskilled labor = meat machine that we need to pay by law, but we gladly wouldn't pay them a dime if we could get away with it because they aren't real people.

-Asshat Owners

[–] [email protected] 31 points 11 months ago (5 children)

Technically skilled as in requiring education (financed by the state), unskilled can learn on the job within days.

But politics has a way with twisting those words into a us/them dichotomy.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago (2 children)

For me it's not really an us/them opposition, my disgust is with how unskilled laborers are viewed/treated because of our lack of education. That somehow makes us subhuman and undeserving of a living wage. That we should be thankful for a minimum wage.

I have no issue with skilled laborers, I have an issue with owners/CEO/etc... us laborers of all skills are in the same boat. Best friend works for Intel, Intel makes tons of money, friend gets pay cut and added responsibility. ¿Que?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

The problem lies in the fact that we need to categorise these subjects to write more effective policy. And it doesn't matter what words you use, they always get these connotations as familiarity grows.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 11 months ago (2 children)
[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 months ago

Close, but that's not a job. It's no coincidence that the destructive practice of using your wealth to suck wealth out of society without adding anything beneficial is called Rent-seeking

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago

That requires no labour though.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Warehouse fulfillment and fast food. It takes little education and training. I can be doing it in a week. Tops.

It's far harder and longer timeframe replacing an engineer for example.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago (1 children)

That's not skilled labor though, that's white-collar office worker stuff.

A better example would be a lathe operator.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago (4 children)

White collar has nothing to do with skilled or not. It's a calculation on time and cost to replace.

I don't know anything about lathe operators but it's very clear that it's harder to replace engineers vs cooking fast food.

[–] sus 3 points 11 months ago

probably the "labor" part

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (1 children)

You're comparing the bottom person at a restaurant with a mid level engineer. You should be comparing an engineering intern with a dishwasher or something. Both are somewhat replaceable (but try running anything without them).

Compare an actual engineer with a restaurant manager or head chef. Both of those require experience and education.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago

An entry level engineer is going to have 2 years of additional math, or coding, or whatever after highschool. I was cooking burgers and running a register at 14. It's easy to learn. Most people can cook a burger as a part of their existence, no training but the specific way they want. Far far more easy to replace and train.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

I don’t think the issue is with the term skilled, I think it’s with labor.

Unskilled labor is McDonald’s.

Skilled labor would be like a machinist or a plumber.

It takes a lot of training, maybe an apprenticeship, etc. maybe even vocational school.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago

I think all jobs at least have the potential to be skilled labor. The issue is with many of these types of jobs the work isn’t paid well enough for someone to stick around and really develop the skills.

Obviously there are many exceptions as there are a lot of really skilled workers working jobs that still pay well below what they should but hopefully, with more awareness and union membership uptick, this is improving.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

Yep most of the time they just stand there they just watch you walk by. To be fair lots of assholes on this side of town.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago

I guess one thing I learned reading this thread, there are very few unskilled jobs nowadays.

Maybe old time admin assistants just collating papers, making copies, etc but even then those are really just unskilled tasks moreso than an unskilled job. They also had appointments to set up, calendars and rolodexes to manage, organization, etc.

I think any unskilled job can be made skilled labour if you're thoughtful about how you do it, and do it well.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

Whatever job Eminem had in 8 Mile on the Up/Down button machine?

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago

No, he thinks it's more work. More work but he was paid slightly more until fast food workers got the bump.

Someone should tell him the harder you work the less people seem to make unless it's something very specialized.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

All Labor is Skilled Labor.

Ask Bezos to work in one of his own warehouses. Ask him to flip burgers. See how long he lasts before he is asked to leave.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Nah nah I agree my guy, but your getting caught up on the social definition. The guy who made the statement, legitimately thinks it takes significantly more skill to pack a box than to flip a burger. Like his definition of unskilled labor just unapologetically includes everyone below him, and all he does is pack fucking boxes. It's GOTTA be satire.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

One skill differs from another qualitatively.

None is higher or lower than another.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

I think this is an example of how much the upper crust has done to divide the main ingredients.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Whooosh? I don't know, but I know what I want to believe.