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Are there any communist or socialist societies existing today? (lemmygrad.ml)

submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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I've been speaking with other more informed communists and they've told me that none actually exist. Is this true?

China, Laos, and Vietnam: now notoriously capitalists. Workers work 12+ hours with no protection in horrible factory conditions. Suicide rates are so high that suicide nets are installed. The air is so polluted millions die from lung cancer, especially factory workers w/out basic masks. Corporations dominate

North Korea: Undemocratically ruled by the Kim dynasty. Jong un indulges lavishly at the expense of his citizens, ordering millions in fine wine and trips from Denis Rodman. They might be the most socialist though, as Juche seems to otherwise be democratic.

Cuba: Sanctions have taken a massive toll, but even taking that into account the country still has its own problems. They have massive food shortages and inventory probs and aren't self sufficient after 60+ years. Why couldn't they've use machinery imported from the Soviet Union to develop their agriculture and fishery? The Soviets supported them heavily. They seem to be incredibly mismanaged or corrupt

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago (2 children)

So, I want to engage in as good of faith possible, here.

The content of North Korean doctrine seems particularly discomforting to people here, lol. Not sure why this is the country people feel the need to stand up for.

It's not about whether it's discomforting, it's about whether or not what you're saying is even true. I have zero reason to believe what you posted has any basis in fact. You initially copy/pasted it with no citation.

Now, the links you're giving are decidedly not Korean. The DPRK puts out works of theory and the like, fairly readily. All I'm asking for is a primary source for this.

But let's assume it's 100% true, for a minute.

Even if it is, and Korean socialism does look the way that these 10 points describe, why might that be? What would drive such an insular, personality-cult driven, set of doctrine?

Could it, perchance, be the fact that the United States set about occupying half of the Korean Peninsula? Reinstalling many of the Japanese colonial administrators the Korean people had just spent decades trying to kick out?

Might it have something to do with the fact that the US bombed the entire peninsula so heavily, that US pilots complained that they were no more targets, and that Koreans literally began living in caves and a result?

If you actually care about Koreans, and are unsettled by the centralization of power in the DPRK, then you ought to recognize that it's US imperial policy that has irrevocably shaped the destiny of the Korean peninsula.

If there's any reason to "Stand up" for the DPRK, it's for the exact reasons you've laid out. If a society is too heal, and overcome the sort of backward despotism you've presented, then the answer is surely to not isolate it more. To not continue to fuel the siege mentality that drives the state ideology. But rather, to work for peace and unification, so that the whole of Korea might, once again, be able to shape its own destiny.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

So I read through his links. There isn't a citation to any of these interviews (a necessity for actual academic journalism) to make sure things aren't being taken out of context. The first document even says that "North Korean experts disagree with these things because they view North Korea through the lens of their propaganda." And even then there are only three uncited interviews, one which is obviously an absolutely outrageous lie that breaking the frame of a photo of Kim Jon Il while polishing it is grounds for the execution of an entire family.

For context, the atrocities of the Pinochet regime are backed up by literally hundreds of recorded, cited interviews, some even by guards who participated in the violence admitting their culpability years later (though usually with the excuse that they weren't the ones committing the mass rape, etc.).

This is nothing. This is unsubstantial.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

"North Korea has shitty policies because it has been isolated from the rest of the world," is a statement that I agree wholeheartedly with, and yes it should be opened to things like international trade. The same holds true for Cuba, etc.