And for anyone asking "Why are we boycotting/blocking lemmy.ml?" Here's a quick recap:
Lemmy.ml is an instance run by admins who are hardcore tankies and will enforce their ideology on their instance through various means from allowing (and pushing it themselves) propaganda (Such as Russia being justified in some way to invade Ukraine) and known propaganda outlets (Like RT) to removing content on their instance critical of their favored authoritarian regimes such as Russia or China and even banning users for such speech or speech critical of them if it's off their instance (Just like the Reddit mods of ol!).
If it was just some random instance it would have been defederated from long ago like the rest of the "Tankie Triad" (Hexbear and Lemmygrad), but they've positioned lemmy.ml as the "flagship" instance and abused that position and influence to become large enough to keep other instances from defederating from them.
Which I believe is harmful to the Lemmy-verse's overall growth and outside reputation. I have seen it come up before on Reddit threads (and other testimonials from people who came back and tried it again) that "They tried Lemmy but it was a bunch of tankies and went back to Reddit"
I don't know about you, but I'd prefer Lemmy to not end up with the reputation for being "Tankie Central " or even worse "Voat 2.0".
So if you haven't joined the boycott yet, join today and help us foster a better healthier Lemmy-verse!
You can take a look around here on [email protected] for documentation of it or checkout this list of curated documentation
On bans and censorships:
https://lemmy.world/post/28480760
https://lemmy.world/post/28481615
https://lemmy.world/post/28482147
https://lemmy.world/post/28480936
https://lemmy.world/post/28482273
https://lemmy.world/post/28481272
https://lemmy.world/post/28481064
https://lemmy.world/post/27674360
https://lemmy.world/post/27674117
https://lemmy.world/post/27673934
https://lemmy.world/post/27673724
https://lemmy.world/post/27577337
https://lemmy.world/post/27378634
https://lemmy.world/post/27346630
https://lemmy.world/post/27341283
https://lemmy.world/post/27288224
https://lemmy.world/post/27156418
https://lemmy.world/post/27054157
https://lemmy.world/post/27008261
Allowing altered headlines and permitting known propaganda outlets:
https://lemmy.world/post/28275465
https://lemmy.world/post/27428838
https://lemmy.world/post/27416097
https://lemmy.world/post/27314050
https://lemmy.world/post/27288953
Spreading Russia talking points like the Ukraine invasion just being a "negotiating tactic" !https://lemmy.world/post/27012640
General negative sentiment to other instances who haven't "seen the way" yet: https://lemmy.world/post/27426510
Open declaration of support for Russia (direct from dessalines (head admin)) https://lemmy.world/post/27352415
"concentration camps were just reeducation camps and weren't that bad" https://lemmy.world/post/26985447
In a recent discussion in the Matrix chat, it was mentioned that donations to support development have recently fallen off quite steeply. I mentioned my reason for not donating anymore is because I can't support anyone who runs an instance like .ml. @[email protected] said I could donate directly to him since he doesn't do as much moderation over there, but also mentioned that donations for development go towards server costs for .ml. Hell no.
If we all stop donating to Lemmy just because the devs are being tankies, how will Lemmy survive?
I don’t want to go back to the bot-ridden reddit with its elon-simping CEO.
That's a fair question, and maybe we should be concerned. They're already saying development will stop without more donations.
There are alternatives. Projects have died or been forked before because of the actions of their developers. OrganicMaps comes to mind (they are both a fork of something, and recently a new fork was started to detach from the developers (I can't think of the name).
I'm just one person, but I'm not going to give .ml any financial support, you can be sure of that.
There is always another site or an community.
Having taken donations for similar shit before: isn't that illegal if they aren't open about it? Had I done that with my donated money I'd have been sued out my fucking ass
Nutomic also said that trans identity was western propaganda and has doubled down on that statement several times.
Can you link to that?
just a post about nutomics post, but at least there is a screenshot:
https://lemmings.world/post/23484515
Are women bourgeois?
I really need to play disco elysium
You see comrade everyone gets their assigned gender in the gender line at the age of 10, is simple no?
Read this in a shitty Russian accent that is slowly becoming a vaguely Ukrainian accent because I have played too much Stalker.
Glavset must be tightening its belt.
Also nutomic is a transphobe
https://lemmy.ml/post/18761554
Which is reason enough to not give them any money in my book
Checks the screenshots. Extremely mid take regarding sports that's shared by a lot of people that aren't terminally online. Transphobe, alright.
Transphobia is bullshit no matter what. Deal with it.
"biological men" is a dead giveaway. Just because a lot of people are transphobic doesn't mean it's okay.
I'm in the modlog a lot so I can confirm that that is true, however, like @[email protected] mentioned, he shares a transphobic flavor of their mindset sooo yea
LMAO "Donate directly to me and you won't have to worry about it! Butttt it'll still go to the exact thing you're opposed to."
Having observed a few different types of small team dynamics in my time, my speculation from a distance is that nutomic is the sensible one who does the bulk of the actual work, and dessalines is the other one.
He kind of has my sympathy and I do like Lemmy as software and it is clearly a good thing, but at the same time, at this point in the world if someone on your team is working to silence anyone who talks about Russia in unflattering terms, you can go fuck yourself as far as I am concerned. I am happy their instance is failing and I hope it keeps on failing until they stop doing legwork for murder, tyranny, rape, and torture. Honestly, “I wish my internet place had more users and people didn’t make fun of me so much” is a pretty mild negative consequence to experience from that.
Nutomic thinks trans people are bourgeois propaganda
Given how the tankie mind works, that probably means that they are actually russian propaganda.
Lol good point
Nutomic is .ml, not doing much moderation is an excuse probably because he has underlings to do it for him.
Cutting off funding because of political differences is stupid. Would you rather this go down the same path as Reddit?
If the political difference is between building a multistory carpark or underground carpark with a park on the ground level, sure, it's stupid. If the political difference is "Russia does nothing wrong, Ukraine deserved to get invaded because of nazi" and "Russia is to blame for being the aggressor", then it's definitely not.
You're allowed to fund propaganda machine, and people allowed to not do it.
Why are you using the propaganda delivery system they created?
I'm not using lemmy. ml
If you peddle propaganda and justify genocide and wish more genocide on the world, I side with the people you deem stupid every single time.
By the same logic you are supporting genocide by using the platform they developed. See how you can make dumb connections like that?
Just had a ml user tell me russians never did a crime against humanity since all they did was kill nazi collaborators and continue to do so today.
You are doing your mental gymnastics to side with people like that. Not a nice look .
And you are using the platform made by .ml admins so you are doing the same. I'm not condoning anyone's politics or opinions. Just be morally consistent. If you don't support their views then why are you using a platform they developed?
Because i was not aware those pieces of shit developed it. Because i am on a federation made by people those monsters want all to be genocided and im not paying a single dime. Thus they are working for free to improve the platform i'm on. Platform that is used to counter russian propaganda.
Lol ok bud. Maybe calm down with the rhetoric. Far left is never going to have the amount of power you think they currently have meanwhile there is an actual Nazi uprising all over the world.
(different user here)
No, but I want the funds to only be used for Lemmy development, not for their tankie server. They are the ones that make it impossible to do one without the other.
Ok have fun going back to reddit then when the platform becomes abandonware.
Ooor I can make it clear where I draw the lines, and hopefully get the developers not to spend the donations on their tankie server. Weird how that works, right?
Guess you can't draw the line at using the platform they developed however.
And why should I? Can you make an argument for how using their platform is supporting their tankie server on a comparable level to sending them money?
A bit hypocritical to continue benefitting off of their labor and time by using the platform but their political views is where you draw the line, yet you continue to use the platform. Maybe if you actually believed in what you said you would stop using the platform and go back to reddit. But do go on and preach from your virtue signaling high horse about how paying $30/per month for their server coet (which they use as a testing bed) is too much for you to handle.
No, I don't see it as hypocritical. My issue isn't their views as you're putting it, my issue is them using my donation to distribute tankie propaganda. If they didn't use my donations for that purpose, they'd get some.
What would be hypocritical would be if I sent them money, even though I heavily disagree with their tankie shit. But I don't do that, so we're all good!
No one is stopping other instances from defederating and stop interacting with .ml. That's the whole beauty of Lemmy. But got it so you can't be morally consistent in benefitting from their labor and time (and in a way paying you with their labor and time by you using what they developed) but you have a problem with what they choose to do with their only source of income , and yes donations are their only source of income in their personal lives. And yes you do have a problem with their views because you wouldn't be so fervent in calling their views propaganda. If you were morally consistent you would stop using Lemmy completely until they changed their political views.
No, I'm not morally inconsistent in any way. You still haven't explained how I am inconsistent. What moral maxims am I following that I'm violating by not donating to the Lemmy developers?
Also, again, they are free to have their views, but I don't want to support them running a platform that distributes those views while censoring other views. Again, this is in no way morally inconsistent. Is this really such a hard concept for you to understand?
They are donating their time and labor to the community, and by extension you, and let anyone use the product they created with their labor and time in any way they want, including Nazi instances. Yet them using their donation funds in anyway they see fit is a bridge too far for you. Do I need to spell it out more for you? If you were morally consistent, you would not use Lemmy at all because you don't believe in free usage of a resource once it's given, whether it's time, labor or money.
Yes, please spell it out further, because you seem to be projecting your own moral views onto me and accusing me of being inconsistent with those. Do you understand that other people have different moral views from you? Or do you literally just not know what "moral consistency" means?
You are afforded the liberty to use their platform how you want to use it but they are not afforded the liberty to use the money they receive as donations how that want to use it. You want to control what your $5 or whatever you donate is spent on. Can you say you that's any better than reddit enforcing their corporate views on their users?
Yes, absolutely?
So you literally just don't know what "moral consistency" is. Crazy.
It's not political differences, really. Go ahead and be communist, I don't care. It's the heavy handed moderation style. It's a 1 sided instance and anything to the contrary gets deleted and a time limited ban. They go against exactly what they think they stand for.