this post was submitted on 11 Mar 2025
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It's wild to me. The crazier the republicans get, the more it's the dems fault. Are the dems perfect? No, not by a long shot. But why waste your time focusing on them? Let's figure out a way to separate the base from trump. We have to get through before it's too late.
It's not that we don't recognize the fault of Republicans, but yelling at them is less effective than mobilizing resources that are supposed to be more accessible to Democrats.
There are tons of campaigning dollars, expertise, and connections locked away behind intransigent Dems.
I think you're being sincere, but saying the same boring shit over and over about the dems isn't doing shit either. Mobilizing them would look a bit different than that.
So what would mobilizing them look like? They know what we want them to do, is it a lack of motivation? A lack of incentive? If the threat of losing their core voters isn't enough to get them to act, what is?
Don't know. I just know that going after the dems the way it seems to be happening, isn't working.
Right now, it goes like this:
I mean, it's a valid question. Why are the Democrats censuring their own? Why aren't the Democrats supporting the popular candidates who can mobilize voters but are more progressive than they would like?
So you're telling me, “That’s just how Republicans are.”
No, I'm saying we need to clean house before looking across the aisle. If we can't even convince our own side that this is urgent and not a game, how on earth are we going to convince the people actively tearing the country apart?
Also, if you think a well reasoned article and an open ear are enough to get the republicans to change, you're sorely mistaken.
Okay, what does cleaning house look like? Because some of those people are in red districts. Also, could you fix the gerrymandering while you're at it? The electoral college is pretty bad and so is voter suppression. After we do all that, we'll get money out of politics.
That's because they could have done something about it instead of playing stupid fucking games and playing nice with Republicans when they were actually in power and all of this could have been avoided, but here we are and they are still trying to play nice with the actual fucking Nazis instead of being leaders and standing up for their constituents. Hell or even standing up for their own fucking peers, Jesus fucking Christ is it so damn hard for them to have some fucking guts to stand up for what's right rather than trying to put up a facade of civility with the fucking Nazis party? FUCK
As someone who has spoken up numerous times about how "DEMS BAD" is a cop-out, the reason why we 'waste our time' focusing on the Dems is because
is a fucking pipe-dream.
Trump could - and in his last administration, literally did - kill their loved ones and they would thank him for it.
The Trump 'base'?
They're monarchists.
If only the king knew about the decrees he's been writing and signing and haranguing us to obey.
If only the king knew...
A problem here is that the democrats don't believe that separating Trump from his base is a pipe dream. They seem to believe it's achievable by simply adopting Republican policy. As someone who's spent most of their working life around Republicans, this is would be a laughable idea if it wasn't so embarrassingly naive. There's already DNC staff, strategists, and future presidential candidates talking about how the problem is they're just too radically far left and they really need to move right to recapture the middle-right. Hey, maybe this time they'll convince a whole 0.5% of Republican voters to vote for them instead of 0.3%! I mean, sure, they could motivate their base to show up for something and get way better margins, but then they'd have to make promises and try to keep them, and becoming yesterday's GOP is just so much easier and appealing to their good billionaires.
There's a second problem that much of the Dem base is legitimately conservative compared to us.
Moving right is no solution at all - it clearly has no positive results, electoral or practical. But moving left, though a far superior option, is not an automatic fix. Nor an easy one, considering that Dem candidates are chosen by electoral primaries.
I think it's more that democratic leadership desperately want to adopt more conservative policies and will use any excuse to do so.
Of course, now that I say that, I should clarify that not all dedicated Republicans are dribbling monarchists who have the approximate civic participation and awareness of serfs.
Some, of course, are outright fascists.
Imo, there's no difference between the ones that go "okay, but I agree under protest" and the ones that urgently push for monarchism. The outcome is the same, the former is just sharing that they lack the conviction to stand for their principles.
My point is more "Some people are legitimately just unimaginative sods who Follow The Leader, but others legitimately want to make society worse, as an ideological aim"
Dems aren't bad because they do bad things, they're bad because they're traitors who sided with a fascist over the American people. Dems would side with Reps over you and I in a heartbeat.
Can we try a machete?
Fixed that for you.
Because they're the only ones with the power to do anything and are supposed to be on our side.
Of course, they're actually on the side of their owner donors whose interests rarely align with ours.
You clearly have no idea how powerful cult indoctrination is. As evidenced by both this and your reflexive defense of the AWOL Dems.
There's nowhere near as much of a chance getting through to his own cult than to the people SUPPOSED to oppose his atrocities for a living.
Conveniently, this absolves you from having to take any responsibility or action about the situation.
Like what, vote? I do that at every opportunity. Protest? I do this as much as my disabilities allow.
Bottom line is that they're the only people vested with the power to enact and block legislation on behalf of the people who AREN'T declared members of the cult and ARE posturing as the #Resistance without doing anything substantial.
It's THEIR job and they're NOT doing it.
You only have two real options: cope or act.
It seems to me history has many more suggestions for action beyond vote and protest. Current organisations are asking for help fundraising, organising, coordinating, messaging, striking. Even protecting the marginalised is an act of compassion and resistance.
Or you cope; it's your life and country, do what you want while you can.
That's just flat out false.
Besides, even if it wasn't, denying that part of enacting change is petitioning those with more power to do so is asinine. It's right there in the first fucking amendment for a reason!
I repeat: directly blocking Republican atrocities using powers that ONLY THEY HAVE is THEIR job that they're NOT doing and that I'm legally NOT allowed to do.
Your reflexive defense of those who have power and attempts to shift the blame to those who don't is eerily similar to what MAGA cult members do every time someone criticizes Trump.
Tell me, what would a third option be?
Petitioning your representatives is action, until you lose faith in it leading to change, then it's coping.
Either you find another action you believe could lead to change, or you don't.
That's what I'm fucking doing: I'm trying to enact change by explaining to party soldiers such as yourself that the do-nothing Dems in Congress aren't perfect so that you might stop shielding them from any accountability for their (lack of) actions.
Clearly you're just as blinded to the faults of your own "team" as the fascists are, though, so I'm gonna stop wasting my time and efforts trying to talk some sense into your addled neoliberal brain.
Oh, sorry for being unclear. I'm not USAmerican, I have no love for the dems other than that they're not the GOP; not actively promoting fascism, enacting pogroms, or dismantling human rights.
I'm an activist. And I currently teach, support and organise people to take an active role in their community.
I know from experience that change needs nimble and concerted action, and on a grassroots level resourcefulness to find the actions that work.
I'm not saying the dems nor others aren't doing what they think is best, I'm saying that you should too. And maybe repeatedly petitioning the people you don't believe capable of helping might not be the best use of your efforts.
Unless it is all you can muster, at which coming to terms with that will almost certainly help both your mental well being and sym-/empathy for other action which will in turn benefit the change.
the democrats have been gradually floating to the right for decades, and rarely put up any sort of fight against the far right bullshit.. and when they do, they aren't in it together as they need to be. they're unfocused, uncoordinated, and don't cooperate enough within their own party. so yea, it is at least partly their fault. if they don't get their fucking shit together, we're doomed. not just the country. but civilization as we know it.
The Democrats are the opposition. Their job is to oppose. Their opposition must be as forceful as the Republicans’ actions are crazy. Table tennis bat signs are not going to cut it.
Sounds good, so who should do that first and foremost? The "elected leaders", right?
And what are they doing? Writiting haikus.
Hence the complaints.
People who refused to vote and are now complaining about either the Democrats or about Trump doing what he said he'd do are similar to people who voted for Trump and are now complaining about Trump doing what he said he'd do. Like what did you expect? And thanks for letting me as a trans person get erased from existence, by the way.
Is this one of those, "As a black man,..." type things. I have no idea about how I'm letting a trans person get erased, let alone you.
I am not part of the LGBT+ community and I'm not an immigrant. That's the thing though, everyone is going through some shit right now. You're not alone in that. Unless you're part of the top 10% in America right now, you're going through some shit.
I've mentioned in previous comments that I'm trans. The regime is specifically targeting trans people by reverting our passports, erasing us from government websites, defying court orders to move trans women to men's prisons, making it legal to surveil us, etc.
None of this would have happened if Harris was president. I agree that a lot of Democrats fucking suck, but trans people wouldn't be freaking out trying to figure out how to survive if Harris had won. Everyone is going through shit, but we're going through more. Republicans' endgame is to have us either in the closet or dead. They're probably getting away with disappearing Mahmoud Khalil and if they do they're probably gonna go for trans organizers at some point.
Biden being president gave us four years to breathe. Harris would have given us another four years. I think the country would have had a complete fascist takeover in the next fifteen or twenty years regardless, but we could have at least given ourselves more time to prepare.
If Harris had won, we would all be in a better place. Even the shithead republicans would be. The only ones winning here right now are the billionaires. What the billionaires haven't caught onto is, if they don't bow before trump in every way, they'll be sent to Guantanamo Bay along with the immigrants and dissidents.
I really don't want what's happening to you to be happening. I also don't want American citizens, soon to be American citizens or immigrants trying to flee a shitty life being treated like they're being treated. Our civil rights, voting rights, social security, etc., are all being stripped. The people in the lower 70% that aren't freaking out, don't know yet. We're all in trouble here.
Because it's either inevitable or impossible, depending on how much they choose to dig in their heels. If reality can't convince them they made a mistake, you sure as hell won't. Also, and equally importantly, progressives must unite behind an effective leadership if they expect to get rid of the Trump menace, and the DNC is not effective leadership. Getting progressives and liberals to stop carrying water for them is the first step to bulding real progressive opposition to Trump and hopefully a half-decent government in the aftermath.
no, that's the thing. we did figure out how to separate the fascist base from trump back in 2016. it was the entire sanders campaign. it turns out when you gave people things they wanted, they used to like it. I know; so fucking weird.
anyway, the dems took that from us, and gave us fucking clinton instead. so fuck them. they took what might've been our last chance to stop this without violence. and they still aren't on our side, even now. never forgive them for that, because they will not improve.
To be clear Bernie was and is able to take away some of Trump's supporters, that's true, but not a majority of them. What made Bernie's campaign (and his entire existence) so effective was his ability to rile up his base and increase progressive turnout.
I'm convinced they axed him just so they could tank this election and give us Trump. They've been on his side this whole time.
he got both people who would have been trump supporters AND compromised with the left. seems like that's a candidate that could have fucking won.
Spoiler alert: Jan. 7th, 2021 was too late.
I think Trump is going to separate the base from himself on his own. Most of them rely on government aid, and he's trying to kill all of it.
You think MAGA cult members are going to act rationally and change their minds based on what is objectively happening?
He's played at replacing God. If Obama did 1/10th of the anti-Christian shit Trump's done, the evangelicals would have been setting themselves on fire in the street. Dude might as well be the actual anti-Christ for how much he's taken in the evangelicals (remember, the anti-Christ ends up deceiving a bunch of "believers" and actually has wild support). Knowing the MAGAs in my life, there is actually nothing that would change how they feel.
Have the Magas in your life been greatly personally affected by his policies yet?
I can think of a few times, yeah, and they have always done the mental gymnastics to justify it to themselves. One of them got fucked hard by the Trump "tax cuts" and yelled that he wanted Obama back (just about gave the other MAGAs at work a panic attack), but remained an ardent MAGA. It always boils down to something like "Benevolent Dear Leader would stomp on me on purpose. Oh, well, these things will happen, but it'll be worth it in the long run".
I think true, diehard MAGA people aren't as common as it seems. Once they start starving, a majority of them will likely wake up to the fact that at least Musk is the one hurting them (and he's really the one causing the damage).
They will keep voting red, but I don't think the loyalty will last when things get hard for them, and they'll feel it quickly since they're the demographic that'll be hit the hardest.