this post was submitted on 01 Aug 2023
72 points (97.4% liked)

Programming

17373 readers
186 users here now

Welcome to the main community in programming.dev! Feel free to post anything relating to programming here!

Cross posting is strongly encouraged in the instance. If you feel your post or another person's post makes sense in another community cross post into it.

Hope you enjoy the instance!

Rules

Rules

  • Follow the programming.dev instance rules
  • Keep content related to programming in some way
  • If you're posting long videos try to add in some form of tldr for those who don't want to watch videos

Wormhole

Follow the wormhole through a path of communities [email protected]



founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (9 children)

Kudos to the people who wrote this and it's great for people who use debuggers.

However I'd like to say that I haven't used one in years and don't see any reason to go back.

I've found that there's way simpler practices that have upped my development speed considerably. Simply think about what you're trying to do more carefully, and read over the code until you're sure it's good. It's the fastest way to iterate. Doesn't work? Read and think again.

You can put a format log in there. You can even comment it out, which can be useful later and for other people. It's plain and simple.

When I find myself using log all the time, it's either because I am tired, and I shouldn't be coding any way. Or impatient, which means I'm wasting time and should slow down. Or I have to deal with a library that has a shitty API, which you'll probably want to avoid using any way. And in that case you can use the interactive console to quickly try things out.

Honestly if there's anything I want to get better at it's test driven development. It tells you clearly whether it's working as expected or not.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I feel like you're missing out on a ton of awesome features by not using a debugger? Step backs are super useful, inline/live commands save you from re-running the code to see a different value, you can change values on the fly.

And it's nice to say "think about your code more" but when you're working with large teams, on legacy codebases, you don't often have the opportunity to "think about your code" because you're trying to decipher what someone wrote 3 years ago and they don't even work with the company anymore.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Have you ever tried my approach? It also works for understanding existing code bases. It just takes some practice, like working a mental muscle. So it might seem strange and ineffective at first.

If you do lots of trial and error and use the debugger you're basically externalizing the work, which slows it down and is less satisfying too imo.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I have indeed. We even practice pure TDD and won't accept PRs without test coverage, but it doesn't change the fact that sometimes bugs happen, and when they do it tends to be much more effective to work through the problem with a debugger than make guesses at what things need to be logged, or poked into or whatever.

If what you're doing works for you, more power to you, but in my opinion I'd never give up a tool in my toolset because it makes me far more productive than I'd be without it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I get where you're coming from, and debuggers surely have their merits. But I've found value in a more deliberate approach that emphasizes understanding and careful code review. Even when faced with legacy systems or larger teams, with practice, this technique can be quite effective. It's less about relinquishing tools, and more about harnessing those that harmonize with our individual coding styles. Granted, it's not a one-size-fits-all approach, but it's what works for me and others who prefer a similar path in coding.

load more comments (7 replies)