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“This Is a Collapse of the Democratic Party”: Ralph Nader on Roots of Trump’s Win Over Harris
(www.democracynow.org)
this post was submitted on 06 Nov 2024
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So they did that once, Hillary was all set to take the nomination in 2008 then this young charismatic guy took the nomination. Obama served 2 terms and the Republicans lost their mind over it....
..... but maybe the Democrats did too? Because Hillary still thought it was Her Turn in 2016, and there were a lot of machinations to make sure they didnt run a Socialist. Then I distinctly remember all the shenanigans to insure that Joe Biden got the nomination in 2020. And we all know what happened this year. I actually think Harris was a good candidate, I just wish she got the chance to prove it in a meaningful primary. (Edited to add: if she had lost a primary, all it would have meant was that Democrats would have found an even better candidate.)
The Democrats do have a deep bench of Governors and Senators who might make really good Presidents. They even proved that strategy worked in 2008. I wonder why they are so afraid to prove it in a primary.
Disagree, Harris would not have been close to winning at all if there was a primary. Even Tim Walz would have absolutely smoked her in a primary.
While I'm not as sure as you are about that, if it had happened that way I wouldn't have minded at all. I liked Harris as a candidate, and feel she would have made a fine President. but I also like other Democrats.
We'll have to watch Walz. His current term ends with the 2026 election, and while he's not term limited he has already been in office for two terms. This campaign might give him the bug to try again in 2028.
Harris didn't even win her home state in the primary she actually competed in. She was always the wrong choice.
The only criticism I have with that is the transfer of campaign funds. Harris was able to take control of the war chest immediately. That's the one justification I can see for giving her the nod.
Yeah that’s really it, I want primaries that feel fair. The staggering of them is one of the least fair elements imo, it’s how none of the people who anyone was excited for won in 2020
If the Dems want to be relevant in the future they need an FDR, not even an Obama will cut it right now. The American people are demanding change, and so it’s going to have to be pretty radical improvements to life or the fascists are going to keep winning. And it needs to be widespread. I’m not saying that they need to start singing the international and calling for us to overthrow the capitalist regime on international women’s day (though, it would be based as hell). But M4A needs to be one of their milder offers and they need to sell people on it. “Life is hard, and corporations have fucked you, the Republicans are telling you to hate your neighbors. We’re going to make this country more competitive for your quality of life, and if the private sector cannot or will not provide you with your needs at an attainable price then we will”
One of the many problems with the Democratic primary was the attitude that we can skip them altogether for incumbents. Dean Phillips got a lot of criticism for daring to challenge Biden, but I have to admit (in hindsight) that he was onto something. If they had staged a debate early in the primary cycle, we might have seen Biden's decline earlier. Phillips might not have ended up the nominee, but we might have had a more rigorous verring of the eventual nominee.
If there is one reform I want to see in the Democratic party going forward, it's that all Primaries be contested. we shouldn't give an incumbent a pass. We should hear him defend themselves in debates before they become the nominee. Heck, have the sitting VP debate the incumbent. Why not?
I agree that it would have been better to have legitimacy, despite the results. Now you have legitimacy, and bad results.
Obama, sadly was a failure. Better than any other president since FDR and Carter, but that's not saying much. America wanted change and all we got was the ACA from him and a few less terrible trade deals. Obama deported more people than Trump and never fixed the decline in the middle class. I turned 18 when Obama first ran and was so excited for all the "change" and nothing improved sustainably for the average American. He could have solidified himself as the best ever but road the middle too often and now the party is officially dead.
We keep using that line about deportation but the problem is deportation is popular. Speedy removal and asylum in Mexico are popular. It's easy for people to blame immigrants.
In the same polls Americans support deportations but also legalization of immigrants in about equal measure.
https://www.vox.com/policy/368889/immigration-border-polls-election-2024-trump-harris
https://news.gallup.com/poll/647123/sharply-americans-curb-immigration.aspx
Republicans have primed Americans into thinking illegal immigrants are criminals bringing in crime and drugs into the country. Which is completely fabricated and untrue. However, since Biden, Democrats have failed to counter message and instead adopted the right wing on immigration. That's the entire reason we see this contradiction. A genuine counter message would be popular. And it's essential considering that Trump is going to start mass deportations, which means concentration camps for millions of Americans
I agree, under the heading that if they can cart anyone away that easily, they can cart me away that easily.
Yeah, the concentration camps will absolutely extend to any legal immigrants, and even people that look 'immigrant passing'. (Not white immigrants like from Canada or Europe of course, it's all racially motivated). I won't be surprised if Trump begins to deport political enemies