this post was submitted on 24 Oct 2024
286 points (81.4% liked)
Asklemmy
43680 readers
2366 users here now
A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
- Lemmyverse: community search
- sub.rehab: maps old subreddits to fediverse options, marks official as such
- [email protected]: a community for finding communities
~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_[email protected]~
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
The definition of genocide is actually extremely strict. Carpet bombing entire cities doesn't actually count. It has to be a concerted effort to eradicate a people group or culture. Because the IDF has a stated objective of "getting rid of Hamas" and not "murdering all Palestinians" it's impossible to prove the intent of their actions. If they were, for example stealing Palestinian babies and adopting them out to Israeli parents, ore forcing Palestinians to get Israeli passports, or forcing them to convert to Judaism at gunpoint, or sending people to reeducation camps, that would be a clear case of genocide. But extremely high civilian casualties genuinely doesn't count no matter how brutal it is.
USAID already reported Israel is using hunger as a weapon. Which very much qualifies.
It qualifies as a war crime but not as genocide. But again their involvement is largely preventing aid shipments from entering Gaza. They are, legally speaking allowed to close any port of entry or exit from their country. There are people starving in Russia and Norway has closed the border. Is Norway committing a war crime? Also if that's the case then why are people not jumping on Egypt? There's a border crossing to Egypt as well. Is Egypt committing genocide?
Just to be clear, I don't support either side in this conflict. And I do think the IDF are probably committing war crimes. But I don't think that it can be proven especially seeing as the official government statistics coming out of gaza are provided by a group that is internationally recognised as a terrorist organisation.
No. They are absolutely not allowed to stop food and aid into the combat zone they created. They are absolutely not allowed to prevent Egypt from sending aid in. They are absolutely not allowed to conduct a naval blockade.
Russia is food secure and has trade access all along Central and East Asia. Norway's closure is in no way the same thing.
When the professional aid distribution people who work for the United States Agency for International Development tell you it's happening, then it's happening.
Okay... if its a war crime and not a genocide, that still qualifies as a way to stop sending weapons.
Huh wonder if maybe Palestine should be legally recognized as a country to prevent this? Oh well, nothing we can do, since the politicians in power don't want to do that.
Every organization operating out of Gaza would get called a terrorist organization by Isreal. It is almost as if America is being intentionally obtuse to allow Isreal to carry out a genocide.
The United States Holocaust Memorial Museum:
Killing members of the group
Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group
Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction, in whole or in part
Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group
Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group
https://www.ushmm.org/genocide-prevention/learn-about-genocide-and-other-mass-atrocities/what-is-genocide
A short list of official allegations of Israel’s genocide against Palestinians (Google):
South Africa's genocide case against Israel
The International Court of Justice (ICJ) has ordered Israel to prevent the destruction of evidence and ensure the preservation of evidence related to allegations of genocide against Palestinians in Gaza.
Israel's use of the "Hannibal Directive"
Israel has been accused of using its "Hannibal Directive" policy, which allows for the killing of Israeli soldiers and civilians to prevent them from being taken alive as prisoners of war. This policy has been criticized as a form of genocide.
UN reports
UN experts have reported "grave violations" committed by Israeli forces against Palestinians in Gaza, including "genocidal incitement" and the use of "powerful weaponry with inherently indiscriminate impacts." They have also cited evidence of Israel's intent to "destroy the Palestinian people under occupation."
Special Rapporteur's findings
The UN Special Rapporteur on the situation of human rights in the Occupied Palestinian Territories, Francesca Albanese, has found "reasonable grounds" to believe that Israel is committing genocide against Palestinians in Gaza. She cited evidence of Israel's intent to destroy the Palestinian group, including causing serious bodily or mental harm, imposing conditions of life calculated to bring about physical destruction, and preventing births within the group.
Amnesty International's research
Amnesty International has gathered evidence of unlawful Israeli attacks in Gaza, resulting in mass civilian casualties. The organization has criticized Israel's failure to distinguish between military objectives and civilian objects, leading to indiscriminate attacks that are war crimes.
Other reports and allegations
Various independent reports and allegations have been made about Israel's treatment of Palestinians, including forced transfers, torture, and the destruction of infrastructure. Some have characterized Israel's actions as genocide, while others have criticized the use of the term without sufficient evidence.