this post was submitted on 25 Jul 2024
144 points (94.4% liked)
Asklemmy
43946 readers
491 users here now
A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
Search asklemmy ๐
If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
- Lemmyverse: community search
- sub.rehab: maps old subreddits to fediverse options, marks official as such
- [email protected]: a community for finding communities
~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_[email protected]~
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Four point on lemmy. I have some comments the between social dem and Marxism line though.
Well... I think public private partnerships are the way to go with profit sharing and workers being a part of the decision making process. I also think a lot of industries should be handled by the government or have a government company that is strictly non-profit. People should also have the choice of a free Internet connection if they don't want to pay for high speeds and public transportation should be free and good. Social housing should be built in massive quantities and nimbyism should not outweigh the benefits of the people.
Taxing negative effects on people via pollution should be taxed out of existence. Natural resources should be state-owned and work for the benefit of the people. Compaign donations should be illegal and loopholes should be closed.
These are all policies that are Marxism inspired but they still keep the capitalist element and a market economy. I think a market economy can be good but really needs a firm hand to guide it so it doesn't fuck everything up.
I believe that this area of policies should be explored more and instead of just saying "Marxism is best" then think about what an economy with 70%-90% collectively owned would look like.
This is what I am talking about, actually. You're currently talking about what you want, without analysis of how to get there. That's why Marxism is incompatible with Social Democracy. Marxists don't believe you can simply vote that into existence in a system where Capitalists have.all of the power.
Lots of shoulds without discussing how to get there.
It's not really Marxist inspired, though. It erases all analysis of Capitalism, all philosophical aspects, and all of the revolutionary aspects of it. Social safery nets are good, but that's not necessarily borne from Marxism. Simply thinking a market economy can be good is already far off of Marxism.
I think this is ultimately born from a lack of engagement with Marx's works, really, though I could be wrong. What have you read from Marx?
I like the ideology of socialism where workers control the means of production but I think a revolution will always put the power in the hands of the few as a by-product. I agree with Marx on a lot of points, but I also disagree with him on others.
Rest assured that this is my own opinion and I seriously thought about it over a couple of years and came to my own conclusion. You can frame the conclusion simply as this:
Capitalism does a lot of bad, capitalism also does a lot of good (think cheaper food production and more investment into equipment for productivity). So there are two solutions. Remove capitalism or remove the bad. In my opinion removing capitalism is a surefire way to remove the bad but will also remove the good. Removing the bad from capitalism is a lot more complex and turns a sprint into a marathon but I think the end product will lead to a more equitable society that's genuinely controlled by the people.
That's my personal opinion.
Historically, Socialist revolutions have done dramatic shifts towards democratization of production.
Cheaper food production and investment into machinery is a core part of Marxism, achieved via central planning. Removing Capitalism doesn't remove these aspects.
Secondly, you don't mention at all how you will convince the ruling class to give you these concessions, it isn't a marathon, it's pushing a boulder up an infinite mountain.
Thirdly, you have not at all explained why Capitalism is more controlled by the people, the point of Capitalism is profit in the hands of the ones who hold the Capital. Democratically controlling production via Marxism makes far more sense.
It's fine to have a personal opinion, but Marxists are going to have similar criticisms of your opinions.