this post was submitted on 05 Jul 2024
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[–] [email protected] 109 points 10 months ago (6 children)

So the problem isn't the technology. The problem is unethical big corporations.

[–] [email protected] 69 points 10 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (4 children)

depends. for "AI" "art" the problem is both terms are lies. there is no intelligence and there is no art.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago (2 children)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

Any work made to convey a concept and/or emotion can be art. I'd throw in "intent", having "deeper meaning", and the context of its creation to distinguish between an accounting spreadsheet and art.

The problem with AI "art" is it's produced by something that isn't sentient and is incapable of original thought. AI doesn't understand intent, context, emotion, or even the most basic concepts behind the prompt or the end result. Its "art" is merely a mashup of ideas stolen from countless works of actual, original art run through an esoteric logic network.

AI can serve as a tool to create art of course, but the further removed from the process a human is the less the end result can truly be considered "art".

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago
[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago (4 children)

As a thought experiment let's say an artist takes a photo of a sunset. Then the artist uses AI to generate a sunset and AI happens to generate the exact same photo. The artist then releases one of the two images with the title "this may or may not be made by AI". Is the released image art or not?

If you say the image isn't art, what if it's revealed that it's the photo the artist took? Does is magically turn into art because it's not made by AI? If not does it mean when people "make art" it's not art?

If you say the image is art, what if it's revealed it's made by AI? Does it magically stop being art or does it become less artistic after the fact? Where does value go?

The way I see it is that you're trying to gatekeep art by arbitrarily claiming AI art isn't real art. I think since we're the ones assigning a meaning to art, how it is created doesn't matter. After all if you're the artist taking the photo isn't the original art piece just the natural occurrence of the sun setting. Nobody created it, there is no artistic intention there, it simply exists and we consider it art.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago (9 children)

i won't, but art has intent. AI doesn't.

Pollock's paintings are art. a bunch of paint buckets falling on a canvas in an earthquake wouldn't make art, even if it resembled Pollock's paintings. there's no intent behind it. no artist.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The intent comes from the person who writes the prompt and selects/refines the most fitting image it makes

[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago

that's like me intending for it to rain and when it eventually would, claiming i made it rain because i intended for it.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (13 children)

AI is a tool used by a human. The human using the tools has an intention, wants to create something with it.

It's exactly the same as painting digital art. But instead o moving the mouse around, or copying other images into a collage, you use the AI tool, which can be pretty complex to use to create something beautiful.

Do you know what generative art is? It existed before AI. Surely with your gatekeeping you think that's also no art.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

there is no intelligence and there is no art.

People said exact same thing about CGI, and photography before. I wouldn't be surprised if somebody scream "IT'S NOT ART" at Michaelangelo or people carving walls of temples in ancient Egypt.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

the "people" you're talking about were talking about tools. I'm talking about intent. Just because you compare two arguments that use similar words doesn't mean the arguments are similar.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Intent is not needed for the art, else all the art in history where we can't say what author wanted to express or the ones misunderstood wouldn't be considered art. Art is in the eye of the beholder. Note that one of the first regulations of AI art that is always proposed is that AI art be clearly labeled as such, because whomever propose it do know the above.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

i didn't say knowing the intent is needed. i believe in death of the author, so that isn't relevant.

the intent to create art is, however, needed. the fountain is art, but before it became the fountain, the urinal itself wasn't.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Technology is a cultural creation, not a magic box outside of its circumstances. "The problem isn't the technology, it's the creators, users, and perpetuators" is tautological.

And, importantly, the purpose of a system is what it does.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago (7 children)

But not al users of AI are malignant or causing environment damage.

Saying the contrary would be a bad generalization.

I have LLM models running on a n100 chip that have less consumption that the lemmy servers we are writing on right now.

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (7 children)

Technology is a product of science. The facts science seeks to uncover are fundamental universal truths that aren't subject to human folly. Only how we use that knowledge is subject to human folly. I don't think open source or open weights models are a bad usage of that knowledge. Some of the things corporations do are bad or exploitative uses of that knowledge.

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago

Always has been

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Considering most new technology these days is merely a distilation of the ethos of the big corporations, how do you distinguish?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago

Not true though.

Current AI generative have its bases in# Frank Rosenblatt and other scientists working mostly in universities.

Big corporations had made an implementation but the science behind it already existed. It was not created by those corporations.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago

This has been going on since big oil popularized the "carbon footprint". They want us arguing with each other about how useful crypto/AI/whatever are instead of agreeing about pigouvian energy taxes and socialized control of the (already monopolized) grid.