this post was submitted on 06 Feb 2024

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Sovereign citizen tried to pay for their car with sovcit methods (letter in the comments) (lemmy.world)

submitted 9 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 66 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (2 children)

So how is this any different, in their minds, from stealing?

They take a loan out to buy a car. They clearly have 0 intention of paying that loan off by citing some sovereign citizen encantation.

How can they reconcile that in their heads?

"I deserve free things at the cost of others, because I'm clever"?

Scum, regardless of your libertarian philosophy.

[–] [email protected] 49 points 9 months ago (2 children)

In their minds, they're not stealing, they just paying with unexpected money.
They're saying "send the bill to my secret government trust account", since they think everyone secretly has one of those that the government opened when they were born and use for Purposes™.

Sometimes they just think they've found a loophole. It's not stealing because it's legal.
If someone offers you a car for free, you'd be silly not to take the offer,even if afterwards they say they would have liked you to give them a pile of money.

[–] [email protected] 38 points 9 months ago (2 children)

They’re saying “send the bill to my secret government trust account”, since they think everyone secretly has one of those that the government opened when they were born and use for Purposes™.

If they really don't think they're stealing, then they would be transparent about their method of payment up front. I very highly doubt they would have received financing if they communicated that expectation while applying.

So it seems more like bad faith excuses than actual belief in what they're doing.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago

I can't speak to their intent or internal state of mind, only to what they seem to say they're trying to do.

I can say though, that I wouldn't assume consistency or rational action to be things I would expect of people who think the capitalization of their name is the difference between them and a shell corporation opened under maritime law by way of their "berth certificate".

Either way what they're doing is fraud.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago

I would guess that they were told by some "guru" how exactly to do it, and never questioned the magic words.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago

Consequences of trying to have unexpected money is expected boot up the ass

[–] [email protected] 10 points 9 months ago

It started with alternative science, now we have alternative law.

[–] [email protected] 51 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I've noticed that these companies are starting to call out the sovCit scam by name, so it seems they've had a gut-full as well...

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago

I know it's a play as old as time but I'm sure the shit EXPLODED in the internet age. I'd bet most companies have a form letter at this point.

[–] [email protected] 45 points 9 months ago (2 children)

[–] [email protected] 25 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Saying authorities have rejected their defence seems... counterproductive? Their whole argument is that they don't accept the court's authority.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 9 months ago

Too bad what they accept doesn't matter.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

This seems more like a polite "We see what you're trying to do and in court you may not realize you will not win" than a "pay us now" letter. I'd guess this is more so that the company can show the court they tried to be reasonable. Doesn't matter either way how the person responds, unless it's with a payment.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago

That letter is from Carvana.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago (1 children)

This was satisfying to read, thanks for sharing!

[–] [email protected] 29 points 9 months ago

It's hilarious that companies have dedicated sovcit reply letters.

[–] [email protected] 31 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Bet repo agents and bounty hunters love the sovcit movement.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 9 months ago (1 children)

New theory: They started it. Vertical integration for the win!

[–] [email protected] 17 points 9 months ago

Now that's a fucking conspiracy theory!

[–] [email protected] 17 points 9 months ago (1 children)

A car payment is cheaper than a lawyer...

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago (1 children)

What lawyer is going to work with someone who thinks they can use "coupon" magic money to pay for contracted services rendered?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Public defenders don't have a choice unfortunately

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Fortunately, they don't need to rely on their client paying them.

Of course, a LOT of these sovcit cases are civil, and you generally only have that right to a free attorney in criminal court. Which is some stupid bullshit, but it is reality.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I think even if this stupid sovcit bullshit did end up being the magic words that somehow worked, I wouldn't want to do it because of the sheer amount of paperwork involved.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago

I heat you there. I read all the paperwork they were about to fill out and remembered why I'm not a lawyer or accountant. Paperwork is not my thing

[–] [email protected] 10 points 9 months ago (1 children)

DJ Screw used to lean and see where that got him

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago

RIP dog cause I really miss you

[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Bones, I've been enjoying these sovcit posts. Some of these (maybe all) are years old, are there no posts from these folks when reality comes crashing down?

[–] [email protected] 18 points 9 months ago

I just keep picking them out of my Facebook posts where I'm starting to annoy my friends with them lol, so it's kind of a snapshot of whatever I saw. But they're not very good about telling us their failures.