this post was submitted on 29 Jan 2025
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[–] [email protected] 144 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Bringing an army of ghosts to a necromancer's gate might not be the smart move you think it is...

[–] [email protected] 13 points 21 hours ago

Plus, they were following him very begrudgingly since he was the only one who could lift the curse.

And he also didn’t know that he would march to the Black Gate next.

[–] [email protected] 163 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Their oath bound them in undeath. Once they fulfill their oath, they can't just choose to stick around. They're a single-use consumable item.

Oh and even they can't just walk into Mordor, because Sauron casts Turn Undead as a 20th level Cleric.

[–] [email protected] 79 points 1 day ago (2 children)

The reason they're cursed is that they favoured Sauron during the final battle of the 2nd age. That's why Isildur cursed them. So it stands to reason they have some issue standing directly against him.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 21 hours ago

Yep. At first I was agreeing here. Like, why didn't Aragorn specify defeating Sauron is the oath fulfillment? But then I realized that yeah, if they worked under Sauron once, its probably safe to say if they directly faced him at the gates he may have some sort of power over them. Too risky. Send away.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 23 hours ago

Oh wow, I just took them as cowards/selfish fucks that said not their problem.

[–] [email protected] 80 points 1 day ago (4 children)

At least in the movie they quite literally fought for Gondor. In the books, they just kill some corsairs far away from Minas Tirth.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

In the books, I don't believe they kill anyone - or can. They basically just scare off the corsairs so the rest of gondors army can join the main battle. So ops point is kinda moot

E: I guess it's a little ambiguous

Pale swords were drawn; but I know not whether their blades would still bite, for the Dead needed no longer any weapon but fear."

[–] [email protected] 5 points 23 hours ago

I don't think that's too ambiguous. I read it exactly the way you put it.

Basically "idk if their weapons work but it doesn't matter they don't need them" so if they don't need the swords one would assume no-one is fighting them and just running like you said.

So I'm just here to second you.

[–] [email protected] 39 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Well if I remember correctly these corsairs were attacking the strategically important harbour that also housed all non combatants from Minas Tirth. The Harbour had a low garrison because they went to support Minas Tirith, so by scaring them off Aragon got access to their ships and saved the rearguard. Both strategically important in the context of the war

edit: grammar and fatfingered

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Oh yeah, the books handle the greater war much more, but that would make for some confusion cinematography. It made a lot of sense, but it's it's also much less... Well, cinematic

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 day ago

Yeah I can totally understand why Jackson simplified it

[–] [email protected] 42 points 1 day ago (2 children)

They don't even kill them, they just scare them off their boats using 'fear as a weapon'.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 23 hours ago

This

The corsairs of umbar flee the boats, the party & rangers take the ships. The whole point of the fleet was to cut off the Dol Amroth reinforcements, which can then join the battle

At Pellenor, they just scare the enemy forces. Once they've fulfilled their oath, they are free.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Idle thought, not fully staffed: kinda turns the whole "you cannot use the tools of the Enemy, as they are evil in and of themselves and will bring even the most noble low" vibe of the books on its head.

Or, at least, I seem to recall passages to the effect of fear being one of Sauron's chief weapons. Could probably find a lit crit essay on this subject if I went digging.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

His chief weapon was surprise, iirc. That's all, just surprise.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 22 hours ago

And their fanatical devotion to the Pope.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Go watch the extended edition?

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 day ago

In the extended edition, they do both (kind of, it's a pretty tiny fleet)

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 day ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

It is as if the realms have been forgotten.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I mean, the least he could've aak. Those guys seemed to enjoy killing, so maybe they would've liked killing more orcs.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 day ago (2 children)

They never specifically killed orks, that's movie stuff. They killed foreign corsairs near the river estuary and fulfilled their oath.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 day ago

They scared them more than killed them even.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 day ago

They never existed, that's book stuff.