Whales are the idiots who keep the Madden games alive.
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Okay, as funny as it is, I don't think the people who are complaining are the ones who are actually purchasing. I am pretty sure that the people who are the majority spenders are not even aware of the hatred on the internet for microtransactions, or even if they are aware, they do not see it as worthwhile concern.
It is easy to get lost in the noise, as many things on internet, everything becomes an echo chamber. But in reality there are a lot of people who thinks it is justified. That somebody is asking for money to deliver a product or a service and they don't care how the equation of "what is worth what " is derived.
For them, its just inflation or expense to cover the cost (basically they take publishers counterpoint at face value, can't blame them honestly), and since it has become the norm, they have given up on taking a moral stance om this and following through
What the fuck did I just watch?
And where can I get more?
the guy's yt channel? https://www.youtube.com/@shapiro127/videos
although I wanted to go with my misrembered futurama quote "There aren't anymore. and there never will be anymore"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGeUfYusTf4&t=19s
but I remembered the quote wrong
At this time I'd like to shill for Warframe.
The game is free. The battlepasses are free. The lootboxes are free. The ways you open those lootboxes are also free. The premium currency is a tradable item, so it is 100% viable to get it and buy premium shit without ever spending real money. Digital Extremes (the devs) once accidentally created a gambling machine (for pet cosmetics), and upon discovering what they did, removed it from the game and refunded everyone who spent money on it.
Warframe is the one game that I've spent more money on than any other game, I'm not biased, you're biased.
EDIT: I'm glad that people around here like warframe.
WF isn't pay to win.
Its pay to look fly.
I was playing the first descendant. They had free armor dye giveaways.
- can't use them unless you can a skin
- when you do use it then it's gone. Stuck on that character AND skin...
Fuck that game right there.
Color packs cost like $2.50 for a paintjob in TFD and that's like 5 colors.
Warframe has color themes with a full set of things like camo, smoke or sky. You unlock the pallete and you can reuse it everywhere in your account.
S Tier game
Don't look at my steam hours
EvE is similar but with a functional economy including scammers, thieves and general douchebags... And spaceships, is pretty fun but extremely addicting and technical.
The problem with Eve is that you will have to join a big group to enjoy it, and if you join one up, you are increasingly going to feel the pressure to whale if you are a normal player who isn't min-maxing the system. The game is chock full of whales.
I love warframe, but having to level every piece of gear up fills my brain with anxiety for some reason so I can't play it much. The combat loop is pure happy chemical.
I come back every year or so and play for a month or two each time, still haven't spent money on it (but starting to think I should, to support the devs)
DE absolutely rules. In an era of constant enshittification, it's so nice to have a dev that is actively, constantly working to improve the player experience. From consistent bug fixes and engine optimizations, to little additions like reworks of old frames and new ways to interact with old content, to the massive story expansions like Whispers in the Walls and the upcoming 1999, it's just a great time to be a Warframe player.
remember when coptering was a thing and instead of just patching that bug they implemented a whole new movement system which includes bullet jumping? yeah, another dev would have just patched it out and give a middle finger to everyone who grew accustomed to that level of mobility.
Just past week restarted the game and I love finding random Tenno in these comments. Hadn't played for a year or more and it's still going strong with exciting new content free for everyone to play. If you're bored of the loot-n-shoot part you can go fishing, decorating, trading, horseriding and whatever else is in the game.
Also love to look for streamers starting fresh and reliving the awe of the game through them.
Good to see that Dark Legacy Comics is still not funny after all these years
Are the whales the ones complaining? Because the whole concept of a whale is that they are the exception. The vast majority of players pay only the minimum amount or slightly more, but the whales dump so much money in that they are still worth more to the devs than the other 99% of players combined.
You're right. The definition of a whale includes that he has enough money to not complain about any price at all.
Except complaining is his kink... Then he gets double the satisfaction from his payments.
A whale doesn't need enough money not to complain. The tactics used to attract whales are meant to build or take advantage of addictions. When I was drinking I would regularly complain about the cost of alcohol yet still spend much more than I could afford on it
Whales aren't people who can afford whatever, so they spend whatever. Whales are people invested enough that the perceived value added is more than the money it costs. Most whales, therefore, are regular people who are addicted to the game rather than moneybags who could easily afford it. So yeah, it does smell of victim blaming. We should be calling out the bad business practice, rather than calling out those being victimized by the bad business practice.
You know who look like whales? Problem spenders who spend far beyond their means, and are preyed upon by predatory business practices that use psychological manipulation to encourage people to spend as much as as they can. Like, I've literally watched video game developer conference talks where a dev explains in great detail and depth on how to hijack human psychology to milk every last dollar they can. Whales stopped being "those who can afford to spend" a long time ago.
Remember the Boycott for Call of Duty? And most of them were playing on Day 1.
This is so bad that it reminded me of reddit protest that I managed to forget about. xD
The worst part was how people that couldnt get off the platform called terminally online to those who could.
Disgraceful behavior...
Right my Sims? looks to how horribly her game is glitching up due to owning more expansions than Maxis ever intended for Sims 4 to actually have
But for real, the idea of an MMO still requiring a monthly fee in 2024 is ridiculous.
in 1998 when it was a new concept and a lot of money had to go into maintaining the sheer volume of people using servers at a time when the internet couldn't handle more than 20 Star Trek fanboys at once without using up all the bandwith, sure. I could see that.
But in 2024 where even small Indie studios can afford regular free content updates and still make a profit from word of mouth game sales? Yeaaah no.
I remember the first big MMORPG that was on the internet: Ultima Online. I wanted to play it back in the day, but I couldn't because I was far too young to have my own credit card to pay (and my dad was quite firmly not going to pay) and in the very late 90s, at least where I lived, the internet was still a pay-as-you-play affair, meaning every second you spent was logged and charged on your next phone bill. Sometime around 2000 or very early 2001 the internet got some plans by the company that had us pay a single fixed fee, so I could remain online as long as I wanted without worrying about a skyrocketting bill.
I'm confused, is this a serious take? How they make their money leads to how the game is designed and who for. If it's advertising it's shit. If it's microtransactions it becomes about min-maxing annoyance for most gamers while attracting whales, gambling and is shit. Monthly subscriptions is a model that needs loyalty and should attract people who want to "live" in an permanent virtual game world.
Ideally I'd want a global "entertainment subscription" non-profit that is funding projects for the players benefits and is somewhat crowd-controlled like a socialist bank.
I've completely stopped playing MMOs, but there is a difference when it's an online service. What I consider absurd are the publishers and developers who close down their MMOs when they still have players who have invested and will invest money into it, without even considering selling it off. I'm looking at you, NCSoft. Almost happened to Spiral Knights, and because it didn't, it's still going. It's like they think that people playing them are players that would otherwise playing their new MMOs, when the reality is they avoid those publishers that don't respect their persistence and investment.
There's also a lot of MMO's with no subscription and plenty of whaling. But cosmetics are cosmetics, there's people that can legitimately complain about a $90 dollar mount if it gives an unfair advantage when they would otherwise not mind paying for just cosmetics. But there are people who don't mind unfair advantages in certain games either, as long as they have a F2P model and the devs have a good rep.
Nowadays, what drives me off is the feeling of never getting the full experience, having to constantly feel that way to avoid getting caught in predatory addiction loops they implement, and just being able to buy a full, self-contained experience for what would otherwise be two months of subscription in an MMO.
The difference mostly is that the old games were games built first and microtransactions second. Slowly creeping up the invasive methods. Which is acceptable for most people.
However new games have a fully fledged out microtransaction system and shop and the whole game is built around maximising profits. Just like mobile games are.
It is rare that when you put the money first you will produce a game that is fun. And definitely not possible to make a good one.
I have the strangest hunch that if a large MMO or game with lootboxes decided to make every item available via unlocks for free but make them all immediately buyable now, they'd have a nice business model. The player isn't buying exclusivity or an advantage, they're buying convenience.
Warframe heard that
The biggest reason of why I struggle to get into any of the subscription-based games, because none of them are only subscription based, they charge you both for the game and the subscription afterward so you have both the price of the game plus any type of expansion packs plus the subscription cost monthly afterward and that's without including any of the microtransactions. I don't know why anyone plays them
Can't understand people who spend hundreds of dollars on virtual shit they don't even own, just a "licence" to rent it. Like how do you spend that much with almost nothing to show for it.
Me after realizing it's me with American Truck Simulator, buying all those DLC and truck packs.
Was going say your right how stupid, then dawned on me I have done this....😭
It's no different than spending thousands on travel or hundreds to watch movies at the theater. You're paying for the experience and entertainment, not something physical.
Isn't that literally everyone who owns digital games? All your shit on Steam is a license to use the software, you don't actually own any of those games.
I mean, I get the point, cosmetics and such and anything virtual is not tangible in the real world but let's not pretend we aren't all doing that with every game we spend money on.
Having said that, the amount of money companies charge for some of this stuff is outrageous. Luckily, nobody is pointing a gun to your head forcing you to buy it!
I'm so happy I don't give a fuck about looking cool or having nice effects in a game.
The only one I ever spend more bucks than I had to is Path of Exile. And the supporter packs give you your whole worth of money spend as premium currency plus you get the usual skins, emotes and tracking tools.
I totally feel that I'm okay with buying functional stuff like inventory space if the system itself feels fair.
In 10 years and around 5000h (only game I play except tarkov for a while) in I spend 122€ so a mount for 90 bucks seems crazy.
Or you can be the etherium guy: get pissy about in game horse armor and make a vehicle for even worse scams.