British Columbia

1354 readers

65 users here now

News, highlights and more relating to this great province!

founded 3 years ago

MODERATORS

Don't be surprised by the B.C. NDP consumer carbon tax step back - In 2008, NDP used ‘Axe the Tax’ slogan to oppose [BC] Liberals 1st-in-Canada broad-based carbon tax (www.cbc.ca)

submitted 1 month ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

9 comments fedilink hide all child comments

In 2008, as the-then B.C. Liberal government was poised to bring in Canada's first carbon tax, the B.C. NDP staunchly opposed it, saying a climate plan should not tax consumers but target major industrial producers such as the gas, oil, cement and aluminum industries.

top 9 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 month ago (1 children)

A re-elected NDP government would scrap British Columbia's long-standing carbon tax and shift the burden to "big polluters" if the federal government dropped its requirement for the law, Premier David Eby said Thursday.

At a campaign event in Vancouver, Eby said his government would end the provincial carbon tax on consumers if the federal "legal backstop" requiring the province to keep the tax in place is removed.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-ottawa-carbon-tax-1.7322033

Who is surprised?

Sounds like the stance is the same as it was in 2008, wanting to tax industry and not consumers, and the NDP aren't looking to be the only Government holding on to a program that has lost support of people in Canada because of a massive misinformation campaign about the tax.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

misinformation aside, tax the industry simply increase their cost and they can still just offset to the consumers no? since consumer don't have others down the chain to offset that cost. I know on the sheet you can't list tax as cost, but if the tax come when you buy the fuel, then it becomes part of the cost for say, a truck fleet company. If you tax the oil/fuel companies for how much they produced/shipped, they will have to raise the cost to account for the lost of potential tax to make the balance sheet or projection look nicer. I can't think of a way to tax carbon and those cost won't trickle down. But tax at the source would make overall consumption reduced since the gov artificially drive up the cost of that resource.

In short, consumer would still foot the bill, but the goal to reduce carbon based fuel stays the same.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

misinformation aside, tax the industry simply increase their cost and they can still just offset to the consumers no? since consumer don’t have others down the chain to offset that cost. I know on the sheet you can’t list tax as cost, but if the tax come when you buy the fuel, then it becomes part of the cost for say, a truck fleet company. If you tax the oil/fuel companies for how much they produced/shipped, they will have to raise the cost to account for the lost of potential tax to make the balance sheet or projection look nicer. I can’t think of a way to tax carbon and those cost won’t trickle down. But tax at the source would make overall consumption reduced since the gov artificially drive up the cost of that resource.

In short, consumer would still foot the bill, but the goal to reduce carbon based fuel stays the same.

The entire point of the tax is to increase the price so that individuals and industries will use alternatives. If companies raise the costs to offset the hit to their profits, assuming the Federal Cons win the next election and remove the federal tax causing the NDP to remove consumer side carbon tax, you as the consumer choose to use less of it or none at all.

Which in the end is exactly the intent of a carbon tax. Make the products cost more so people aren't so inclined to use them.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Yeah, I am talking in macro scale. The things as consumer can choose to avoid:

change to non-carbon fuel vehicle or get rid of personal vehicle and choose public transport if available.
do less things to increase carbon foot print. (like dial the thermo stat and put on more clothing in winter. )
buy stuff from company that have goals toward carbon neutral.

But as consumer I can't avoid:

increased price of grocery/goods from manufacturing or shipping
the way companies decide to approach their own cost cutting/offsetting.

The important part is, where the carbon tax go? Do they go into hands that actually have goals and plan/milestone to meet? Or they go into some paper green RnD subsidiaries of big oil?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Where the money goes

The money is returned to the province or territory where it is collected. Provinces and territories with their own carbon pricing systems will use their proceeds as they see fit. The Government of Canada does not keep any direct proceeds from pollution pricing.

https://www.canada.ca/en/environment-climate-change/services/climate-change/pricing-pollution-how-it-will-work/putting-price-on-carbon-pollution.html

Consumers also have a choice not to support companies as they see fit. Shopping locally sourced goods goes a very long way.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 month ago (1 children)

It goes back to province and then where? If it benefits everyone, say upgrade the library to be more energy efficient, provide rebates if you upgrade your heat/aircon system to modern standard of your buildings, like those I'd say that's good use of carbon tax money. But if dumped to some big oil RnD branch for green energy tech that we won't see in another 10/20 years, cause they do not have any motivation to actually pull it. (since their balance sheet is neutral once they get the tax money back from one of their branch/subsidiary. ) I might be biased cause I lived in a old tower building, I really wish our building can start the window/etc remodeling but I only have 1 vote. (my winter base board heating is 200+ on coldest weeks, cause the entire building's windows are over 25+ years old and already leaking and not up to par. )

I do wish there are more locally own/operated grocery stores or farmer's markets. But they are usually located at the out skirts of the city and then you have to drive to get them. The web operated aren't exactly benefiting those farmers nor consumers nor the carbon goals and more expensive/less choice. (because quantity and delivery vehicles etc. )

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago

It goes back to province and then where?

You are literally communicating to me on a device that could answer your question. I also provided you a link with more information.

I am not going to hand hold this conversation for you when all you are doing is speculating.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 month ago (1 children)

We have our own carbon tax in BC, it has nothing to do with the federal government.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 month ago

I am aware.