this post was submitted on 09 Aug 2023
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To extrapolate:

People often say that one should not worry about what others think of them, but life simply doesn't work that way. What other people think of you really does matter; point-in-fact, it can be everything depending on what field you go into.

Like say, for example, you're a business owner and you're recorded arguing with an angry Karen of a customer, the video's posted online, and the internet sides with the Karen. Then, people boycott your business and you're left without a livelihood.

Or perhaps you say something crass and get cancelled. Or simply anger or inconvenience someone with a lot of influence.

Or, even more horrifyingly, say you were assaulted and you came forward, and were ostracized and shunned by your community as a result.

How could one set up their life such that it would be impossible for people like that to rob one of their livelihood? How could one make it impossible for others to shun or ostracize them?

How could a business owner set up their business so that other people couldn't simply shut it down on a whim in such a manner?


EDIT: I'll just "be myself" since that's what the majority of people in the thread want and repeat what I said to another individual:

Honestly, the way everybody is acting is really, really shameful. I am a person who made a thread and gave it a [Serious] tag because I wanted serious, literal answers to a serious problem that, given my chosen career path, will affect me at some point in my life and could potentially ruin it without good info to prepare for such a crisis beforehand. But all I’m getting is denial, mockery, condescension, lies, put-downs.

And it’s rooted in this desire to either pretend the problem is not real because you’re all secretly afraid it’ll affect you yourselves, or it’s because you know it’s real but you view it as a positive because ostracization and shunning people is an emotional cudgel you wield to silence people you don’t agree with on the internet, and answering the question honestly would require framing such actions as a negative and that would make you question the morality of your actions. And that’s not only sick, that’s just cowardly. If you believe cancelling people is morally A-O good, then at least have the temerity to threaten me with a “Don’t speak your mind and mask up” response like at least a few people were honest enough to do.

But don’t insult my intelligence by thinking you can lie to my face and pretend that something I’ve been personally watching happen to other people for over a decade is not, in fact, happening.

Now I came here for a serious answer to a serious problem that affects everyone. If you can't participate in good faith and offer meaningful strategies to avoid or fix such problems and want to either misconstrue it as an emotional issue -- much as you'll do with what I'm saying here after the majority of you demanded I just be myself and not worry about the consequences -- or outright deny it's a real problem when it's been real for over a decade, just don't participate in the thread. Just go elsewhere.


Okay, I just acted like myself. Everyone happy?

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Silly, business owners dont argue with their customers, they dont work there.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

What you think of others matters equally as much. Be a good person and be careful who you surround yourself with. Be descerning of different groups of people and their beliefs/values/culture. Being rejected by a group of bigots is a good thing, and you wouldn't want to be embraced by them to begin with. There are countless historical examples of individuals led astray by group-think, so don't be too concerned what multitudes think of you. It all depends on context, and wanting to be "rejection proof" might signal too much interest in one's reputation, although I'm not accusing you of that.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

I would also love an answer to this question. I have worried about this issue a lot. One of the only answers I have come up with is to have multiple skills. So that if people "side with a Karen" for example, you can hopefully transition into a different industry and leave the previous industry behind. Varied skills in multiple areas are the way I hope to avoid cancellation

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

It's human nature to do what you said. Just keep being human. Bring back to others what they deserve.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

if you try you’ll push yourself into a bad mental space that many therapists make their livelihood off of! I am a big people pleaser so have had issues with over-valuing the opinions of others. One important thing I did to combat this tendency was to come up with a reasonable set of principles for myself so that I didn’t feel like I always had to take what others might think on board (because I’d given myself a reference). Another thing that helped was eliminating anxiety around things I was quite certain one shouldn’t be judged for (in the sense that some things just shouldn’t reflect on your character).

Being worried about having your job taken away and similar is a bit different. I think the things you do to prevent risking this include not voicing “hot takes” except with people you trust and who understand you, avoiding internet arguing, keeping your boundaries up at work, etc. I think most people have a pretty good sense of what ideas might be wildly unpopular in their locale.

As a slight side note, things like tenure (in the US) and anonymous review processes in academia were put in place precisely to ensure that people weren’t blackballed for theorizing things that were unpopular or that would potentially step on the toes of some politician who was threatened by your research. Many things that are popularly supported have and will continue to be wrong, so you need a certain self assurance to fall back on. Preferably your self assurance is supported by logic and reason and not dogmatism—but this entails a fair amount of hard work and study and reflection—you can’t just rely on intuition.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Just come to terms, probobly through traumatic events, that all life is is rejection. Then there is no rejection. There all done!

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

Don't be a business person who lives to exploit workers and fuck over the world.

Don't be surprised when the moral code you live by that is founded entirely on the exploitation of others means the exploited need little reason to cheer on your downfall.

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

What you want is something you can't have. Stop worrying about things that don't immediately affect you and take a fucking chance in life. You will fail. You will make mistakes and judge yourself for it. People may judge you for things beyond your control like appearance and personality quirks. Fuck em. There's only a hand full of people who know and care for you well enough that their opinion matters, the rest of em just see a shadow on the wall. Most people don't care about you, they care about comparing themselves to their mental image of you. Who cares what they think. Do you have like severe anxiety of something because this is hardcore catastrophizing. 99% of your fears are baseless. You aren't the center of anyone else's world, nobody thinks about you that much. Sorry to burst your bubble but the sooner you realize this the sooner you can start to chill a little on the worrying.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Who cares what they think.

I do, because those people are either my employers or my customer base, and I need their money to survive.

If we lived in a perfect world where everyone had their own 40 acres and a mule and didn't have to depend on other people to survive, I'd believe you. But we don't, and as a member of society I am dependent on these people to live.

And most people are aware of this, and don't really want to give a meaningful answer to my question because that would mean losing the power they wield over me, so the only meaningful response is to dismiss the reality of the situation or wrongly frame it as an emotional issue when it is anything but. My fear over it is extremely justified. People, including rich and powerful celebrities, have lost everything over this.

Take Sinead O'Connor, for example, who was cancelled in the 90's for opposing the Catholic Church and trying to expose their sex abuse scandal. And she died, her reputation having never really been repaired, in the U.S. at least.

It matters. It's real. And it's a very, very valid concern. What other people think doesn't just matter, it means everything if one wants to live.

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