this post was submitted on 05 May 2024
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Mechanical Keyboards

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Are you addicted to the clicking sounds of your beautiful and impressive mechanical keyboard?
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Here you can discuss everything about mechanical keyboards (and only mechanical keyboards).

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[SOLVED] I'm cheap and want a Linux keyboard (mander.xyz)
submitted 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
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Thank you everyone for taking time to help out. While looking for keyboards, I’ve found a great deal on a new Keychron C3 Pro at Amazon for around $30. It’s a wired keyboard, but it’s got hot swappable brown switches and I figured there’s no way I’d find something better to dip my toes in this hobby.

And I’m really glad I did! The feel and sound of it is just so much better from my regular keyboard it’s not even funny.

I’ve got some sample switches and o-rings in the mail to further dampen the sound but I’m very happy with my purchase.

Original text below:

All those really sweet compact keyboards are super sexy and I want one. But the ones I like are both:

  • very expensive
  • have windows exclusive software

I’m not even sure mechanical keyboards are for me, to be honest. I don’t type that much, and the keyboard I have - a Logitech wave ergonomic keyboard - suits me, except for the humongous size and the noise (I do a lot of video calls and it gets distracting to my interlocutors).

From my research, a QMK/VIA 65% keyboard would be ideal. The VIA part would allow me to configure the few extra keys and layouts so I can make the most of the keys I’ll have. And it’s Linux compatible. However, it seems the controllers for VIA keyboards make them significantly more expensive. Then there’s the noise issue. The click clack, while tactile satisfying, is a no go for me.

I went down the rabbit hole and to find something that has a chance of suiting me, the cost quickly balloons above $200, and for something which I don’t know if I’ll like. If at least I knew it wouldn’t be too loud I might justify forking that kind of money.

Is there a keyboard for me? How can I tell if it’s going to be too loud? Or should I just give up that search and go for a normie tenkeyless keyboard?

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Can you give examples of the "really sweet compact keyboards" that are both expensive and windows-only?

For custom mechanical keyboards, $200 is about the starting point.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I don’t have anything off the top of my head because I didn’t dig much into it once I found out they didn’t support Linux or the price was more than I’d like to pay for something that might not suit me. But I am not really looking for something custom.

Trying to find something as an example there’s this Iqunix unit that is interesting (though I’d prefer a more cassette futurism design).

I’m not saying it’s not worth it, it didn’t seem a good fit for me. That was before I learned from Shareni here that I wouldn’t strictly need a VIA unit. The other issue is I had no clue if the noise would be acceptable, or even if it’s a reasonable expectation to have out of a mechanical keyboard to be quiet.

So dropping that money on something that might not fit me in any way is a hard ask. I hope I made myself clear, if not, let me know.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 7 months ago

I built a budget custom board using this chassis, gateron yellows, and cheap no-name keycaps from amazon for about $150. Judging by the images I found online for "cassette futurism", this may be your style and is pretty quiet.

https://ymdkey.com/products/gb-ncr-80-r2-vintage-mechanical-keyboard-kit?_pos=1&_sid=6bb93662c&_ss=r&variant=39487470469181

[–] Shareni 9 points 7 months ago (1 children)

You can use kmonad to configure keys, layers, layouts, etc. on any keyboard. AFAIK unless you're going to use the keyboard on random computers, it can replicate all of the functionality you'd want.

For sound:

  • find a physical model to try out
  • order one of those switch samplers
  • find info from reviewers

Additional food for thought: get a keyboard with hot-swappable switches to possibly replace them with quieter ones. Also there are tricks to make it quieter like adding o-rings and a shock absorber for the bottom plate.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (2 children)

unless you're going to use the keyboard on random computers

That’s great! The keyboard is meant to be stationary, indeed.

  • find a physical model to try out

I’d love to, but where? Are there stores that stock them?

replace them with quieter ones.

Hoping to avoid buying something I won’t use, but I’ll keep that in mind.

Thanks a lot for the tips!

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

If you're in the US and have a microcenter nearby, they tend to have a lot on display

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago

Sadly, the closest one is ~5h away. Thanks though.

[–] Shareni 2 points 7 months ago

That’s great! The keyboard is meant to be stationary, indeed.

Try it with your current one first. I've only installed it through nix and guix, so it might be a possible issue for you if it's not easily available.

I’d love to, but where? Are there stores that stock them?

No clue. If you can't find that keyboard in the area, look for keyboards using the same switches. It's not the only factor, but probably the most relevant.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

I've got a Keychron V1 and it's great. The software works fine on Linux. Once you configure it, it's all stored in its firmware. The brown switch version of any option you look at is probably what you want if you don't know what you want/need.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 7 months ago (2 children)

https://www.keychron.com/collections/keychron-c-series-keyboard-s1/products/keychron-c1-pro-qmk-via-wired-mechanical-keyboard

Cheap, supports QMK/VIA on linux.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Why can't any of them have a compose keycap?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)
[–] [email protected] -1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I'm not sure what those strange things are, honestly.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

So this is a programmer keycap set, with lots of options related to the key cap profile.

Cherry is one of the most common, and close to OEM which is what most mass market keyboards use. XDA is a lower profile key cap with rounded edges. SA is a very dramatic profile and reduces travel distance to upper row keys and looks more like 60s/70s terminals. MOA is kinda cool as its a square cap that lofts to a round top.

https://www.keychron.com/collections/all-keycaps/products/iso-oem-dye-sub-pbt-full-set-keycap-set-developer

This is another great set in OEM profile.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

But they have absolutely nothing to do with unix systems. They're just a cutesy set made to look vaguely "techy".

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Do you mean that they the key press has nothing to do with the key cap, or just that the caps are unrelated specifically to *nix commands and shortcuts?

If you want the key press to send a specific *nix based command then you just program it to do that in QMK and create the keymap to fit your needs. You can even have multiple key maps and swap from one to another if you want a console/terminal specific map.

As for *nix specific key caps, there are not many out there and the sets I linked have some of the ones that could be used for specific tasks if you wanted. They are not perfect but they are better than a dedicated windows or co-pilot key.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I think the confusion stems from the fact that you're not familiar with what an actual unix machine keyboard is. Look at Sun keyboards for one that's close to the pc style, or at the space cadet for a historically significant albeit a bit extreme one.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I mean its been 30ish years since I used a SUN or DEC system, but I know the key your talking about, what I dont understand is do you just want the key cap, or do you want the functionality of they key?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

The functionality is trivial to add. I'd just like the proper keycaps.

I think I'll just have them custom printed. Super, Hyper and Compose.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Ok, now I am clear, if I see any unix specific key cap sets I will send them over. Sorry for all the confusion.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago

No problem ;)

But it's a recurring quest. I know the question comes up regularly. And I've never really found anything so far. I'm definitely open to suggestions though!

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

What’s that?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Basically a keycap that says "Compose", for the (wait for it) compose key.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

So they can have them, they just don’t come prepackaged?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

It's not one that's usually made, no. Because they target windows and mac users.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

You’re not lying. Looks like you either like one of two designs or you somehow have to make it yourself.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

On those you linked, they replaced the Enter key with Compose, which doesn't make much sense (they don't seem to know what a Compose key even is). Explanation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compose_key

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I’ve linked an image search page for “compose keycap”. I saw some in place of the Super key, right shift, Caps Lock…

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago

The best replacement imo is menu or one of the windows keys.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Thank you very much for that, I’ve been real happy with the C3 I got.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago

Awesome to hear, Keychron makes some keyboards that are a great value, even if they are not the best.

I keep going back to my K4v2.

[–] hascat 4 points 7 months ago

Keychron makes keyboards in a variety of sizes, and most you can configure with different types of switches. They're priced well, too. I'd start there.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Lots of good advice already, but there's two things I'd add:

  1. If you can't find a place to test different keyboards you could also get a switch sampler first. They're relatively inexpensive, at least compared to getting a keyboard you don't end up liking. You don't need one with lots of keys or with multiple brands, as long it contains the major types (Clicky, Tactile, Linear) and has some variation in actuation force. Worst case, you end up with a new fidget toy.
  2. You don't necessarily need VIA, just QMK. There's the online QMK configurator, which allows you to configure your keyboard, download it as custom firmware and flash it. If you have some experience as a developer you can also just grab the QMK firmware and customize it that way. QMK offers excellent tooling and tutorials that makes this incredibly easy, particularly on Linux. I'd recommend checking this out even before deciding on a specific keyboard model.
[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 months ago

I 2nd this. I'm not a very good programmer, but I have been able to use QMK Firmware to customize my keyboard. It's mostly modifying existing code, and working with a command line (I use MSYS2 on Windows).

QMK Configurator and Toolbox is quite straightforward too: map your keybinds, download firmware, and flash it on Toolbox. VIA is nice, but I don't find myself using it very often.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

Keychron V2, choose the prebuilt with either red or brown switches. If those are too loud, you can swap the switches for silent ones. I am out of date with switches nowadays, but Rtings says TTC blueish-white are good, so that might not be a bad starting point for your research.

Quick edit: for the software, you could also run it in a Windows VM then give the VM access to the USB port.

Also, if you can make do without keyboard specific software, there are some new old stock BTC 5100C boards on eBay. You'll need an AT to PS/2 converter if you want to connect it to a desktop, but all in it should be under $70 USD, excluding shipping. The layout (75% but really really weird) takes getting used to, and it doesn't have N key Rollover if that is something that matters for you, but they are a quieter keyboard than most due to their BTC dome with slider mechanism.

Chyrosran22 did a review of the switch [link]. Fair warning: I don't know if he does in that video, but he can use very non-PG language at times, so if you aren't OK with that you might want to avoid the video.

Edit edit: also on mine the space bar stabilization is utter garbage, its been a while but I think only after a bandaid mod and lube was it acceptable. Legit I think even a person who just uses generic office keyboards might complain about the space bar, it's that bad.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

You can checkout Nuphy. They have a number of relatively affordable options that support QMK/VIA and they have put a good amount of thought on reducing noise. The Air60 V2 may fit your needs though it is a low profile keyboard.

The Halo65 is also another option if you want high profile. It is not currently QMK/VIA compatible though but the V2 should be when that ends up getting released.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Keychron's V2 (65%) might work for you as a good intro. The Barebone Knob option comes without switches and keycaps, so you can test out a few switches ahead of time, perhaps with a keytester set. For keycaps, you are best off just buying a 'clone' set from Aliexpress or Amazon, if you're trying to get decent quality at a cheap price.

In total, I would expect this setup to cost around $110 before shipping costs and tax.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Thanks! The price difference to a fully assembled one is $15. Wouldn’t it be cheaper to get the assembled one and just change the switches? Or are the stock key caps not worth it?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Switch prices can range quite a lot, since there is a decently large enthusiast market for switches. However, I took into consideration that you mentioned you don't like to buy things you won't use (the stock switches). I figured it would be better to suggest that you try some switches before you pay for any in bulk.

As for the keycaps, they are not bad. They're not amazing either, but for what you pay ($15 additional for switches and keycaps) you aren't gonna beat the price. I just imagine most people are happier having some level of visual customization, and you can't really see the switches unless you have a keyboard with "floating switches".

By the way, if you are comfortable keeping the keycaps but swapping out switches, you may also be interested in the Keychron V8. It has somewhat of the ergonomic layout of your current keyboard. It's only available with blue switches, which are clicky and wouldn't be appropriate for working.

Sorry that this is getting so long, but one more comment: if you decide to go the barebones route, you will need to make sure you find a keycap set that has 65% compatability. Keys that are frequently missing include the bottom row cluster to the right of the spacebar, and the far right column of keys as well.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Oh don’t apologize, and thank you for all the tips!

And while we’re at it, I’ve had a hard time finding third party key caps for the Alice layout. Is there a better keyword to search for or are they really rare?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

I don't think there is a "standard" for alice layouts, but you definitely will have to check for key compatability. I found Keychron V8 keycap sizes on their site here, so you should generally look for keycap sets that show you what additional keys are included, such as in this listing and this listing.

You also need to keep in mind the rows (R1, R2, etc.) if you want the profile of each row of keycaps to be consistent. Worst case scenario, you can manually measure the length of each keycap by comparing to 1u keys and known lengths (i.e. standard RShift is 2.75u on ANSI keyboards, LShift is 2.25u, etc.), but that gives you no insight on profile.

Last but not least, I have seen people buy monochromatic keycap sets in a specific profile, such as Cherry profile, and then buying a second smaller set of supplemental keycaps in an accent color (also in Cherry profile). This usually costs more and can lead to mismatched keycaps if not careful or unlucky.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago

I have a Nuphy Halo 75 that I'm rather thrilled with. I have a 65% and TKL Leopolds, with Topre and Cherry Clears respectively, that I also love. But I wanted to go wireless, and I wanted RF instead of Bluetooth. I also wanted a happy medium 75%, and the Nuphy checked all those boxes.

I got baby kangaroo switches, as I love tactiles, and I really enjoy them.

A couple caveats:

  1. The v1 uses a proprietary tool for programming the layout. The v2 uses QMK/VIA, but the 65 isn't available in v2 yet.
  2. The keycaps are kinda meh. Coming from a Leopold, which has very nice textured PBT keycaps, I knew I wouldn't be happy. I ordered some Osume keycaps, and they greatly improve the quality of the experience.

I was considering a Keychron, but just got the feeling that the QC may be a bit lacking compared to Nuphy. I can't back that up, and have no idea if it's true, it's just the feeling I got from reading reviews.

I also considered a Zoom75, but haven't had the time for a first build, and availability wasn't great.

Do you need wireless? Do you need it to be programmable? If the answer to both of those is no, I'd definitely recommend Leopold. They do have some bluetooth boards now, but my experience with bluetooth input devices hasn't been great.

Varmillo is another one to look into, with the VXT67 in particular looking interesting. That glintstone colorway is gorgeous.