this post was submitted on 19 Jun 2023
33 points (100.0% liked)

Technology

104 readers
2 users here now

This magazine is dedicated to discussions on the latest developments, trends, and innovations in the world of technology. Whether you are a tech enthusiast, a developer, or simply curious about the latest gadgets and software, this is the place for you. Here you can share your knowledge, ask questions, and engage in discussions on topics such as artificial intelligence, robotics, cloud computing, cybersecurity, and more. From the impact of technology on society to the ethical considerations of new technologies, this category covers a wide range of topics related to technology. Join the conversation and let's explore the ever-evolving world of technology together!

founded 2 years ago
 

A standoff between the site and some of its most devoted users exposes an existential dilemma.

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 year ago (9 children)

"These people who are mad, they’re mad because they used to get something for free, and now it’s going to be not free. And that free comes at the expense of our other users and our business. That’s what this is about. It can’t be free."

Funny, seems like he has been getting all of it from content to moderation for free, and now he is the one angry it isn't free any more....huh.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (8 children)

If they had charged API fees such that 3rd party apps would have had to charge a monthly fee to users....I would have probably just paid. And I know I'm not the only one.

But they priced it intentionally to kill 3rd party apps, because they wanted to channel access through their garbage app with its "promoted" ads all over the place.

It's not about "free vs. not free" it's about intentionally killing off the applications that made reddit likeable as a platform.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

Yup, if two months ago they said reddit premium members won't experience any changes, and started pushing ads to 3rd party clients and restricted NSFW posts on 3rd party clients without premium I bet there would have be considerably less push back. I know I probably would have ponied up to $60/year,but instead I have abandoned the site without any intention to return.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (6 children)

That's why this whole debacle is so mystifying to me. If they would have tried to monetize the 3rd party space by way of charging a reasonable API price to the devs, it's not hard to imagine that most serious Reddit users wouldn't have any qualms with parting with a few bucks here and there to keep the status quo. I can't imagine that Reddit is able to create a situation where they earn more from their advertising platform per user than having users simply pay to maintain the existing experience.

The only theory I've heard that makes a lick of sense is that if Reddit fundamentally changes the site experience to pursue other monetization options (Hello Reddit NFTs), then 3rd party apps would've been able to just ignore implementing those features entirely.

load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (13 children)

I had thought those where your words at first, you can quote like this;

These people who are mad, they’re mad because they used to get something for free, and now it’s going to be not free. And that free comes at the expense of our other users and our business. That’s what this is about. It can’t be free.

I'm struggling to show you what symbol it is without it turning into a quote, so here's a picture of the greater than symbol;

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

To display formatting characters without having them actually affect formatting, put a backslash in front of them. Like this:

\>

That produces this:

>

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)
load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (12 replies)
[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

But the ownership class always deserves to get things from regular people for free. It's only those of us who make our living from our physical or mental labour, rather than owning property, that don't deserve free shit.

That's just the hierarchy in action, doncha know.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

Yep mainly moderator's.

Also the thing we were getting for free (or paying for app) was a good service. If the Reddit app wasn't crap when could have had that money. Many pay for premium to remove ads and still use these apps

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Seems like a case for r/selfawarewolves ... If that's a thing that still exists.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (4 children)

It's the same as when he started talking about "landed peasantry", the projection is strong, aware or not.

load more comments (4 replies)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

You're right on the money. Spez is just a generic CEO waving his dick around. Prick.

load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The money quote IMO is at the end:

Reddit, like any commercial platform, is only a community until its owners need it to be something else.

That's a good reason to be mindful of what we're building here on Kbin, Lemmy, and other federated networks. We're not just trying to build a Reddit methadone, to help us down from our high after quitting cold-turkey. We are, I hope, aiming to build (or rebuild) a community -- one not dependent on the monetizing whims of a private owner.

The author is right: Spez lost site of the community aspect. Here's an opportunity to show them that the idea still means something to a lot of us.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

If for some reason kbin becomes bad, you just move to another instance (that defederated kbin) and you still get the prior cached posts and comments, just new stuff won't be shitty. I guess you'd have to leave your kbin profile behind.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

Considering there's no global karma, your account isn't much more than your subscription list, and down the line migrating that should get easy!

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

One thing that the Reddit guy says that is true, it takes money to run sites. People joining the Fediverse need to realize this and should consider contributing money to their instance if they can.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

That's honestly one thing that I think will be a problem for many Fediverse services and instances. People nowadays are extremely loath to pay for any sort of online content or service. That's why ads proliferated; nobody wants to pay for eg. news, video streaming or a social network site, and the people producing the content and services need to eat too.

Many have been so conditioned into getting everything for free that they get outright angry when someone suggests that maybe news and social networks are so shit nowadays is exactly because they have to bait people into clicking on stuff so they'll see more ads, and that maybe they should be paying for the content they consume instead of assuming they're entitled to it by virtue of being online

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I come from the era of the BBS. The PHP Forum. SlashDot, and Digg. I come from online games ranging from EverQuest, to Multiverse Crisis MUSH, to Moments in Tyme, to Warframe, and More. I have walked messenger clients from the times of AiM, IRC and Yahoo, to Skype, Steam, and Discord.

In my thirty years of being online, this is not the first petty tyrant claiming that upset users are the problem rather than taking a long hard look in the mirror. This will not be the last.

The best we can do is grab popcorn and watch as his platform dies. He won't admit to making any mistakes. Especially with money involved because he's under the deluded belief that showing any weakness invites a price drop from investors. Yet this behavior? It REEKS of weakness and insecurity.

Migrate and Move On. the rest is just playing u/spez's game.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'd expect that Matrix and Revolt will eat a small portion of the discord userbase. Twitter and Reddit are clearly shattering into pieces.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

That would be nice! The last time I was on Matrix, there wasn't much going on, but I'm seeing a lot more community servers being set up. It might be time to update my old instance and join some channels!

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

One thing that spez notes is that the communities are supposed to be democratic and he's pushing towards having moderators and admins of the subreddits being left to a vote... While at the same time increasing the amount of draconian measures by implementing his own moderators of the communities.

I feel like the ability to vote on mods and admins of communities should've been implemented ages ago on Reddit to decentralize the power trip, but now with spez doing businessman things instead of harboring a passion for people/ease of use/whatever Reddit's initial purpose was, this change has come far too late.

He seems to misunderstand that the people who use and contribute to Reddit use it like other social media platforms, but it's simply not the case. People use Reddit to stay on topic about their hobbies and passions, and ease of use is a huge part of that. Reddit has been constantly trying to inject more invasive shit into user's feeds: chats, video ads, obnoxiously colored ads (in the app), those dumbass live streams that they pushed for a hot minute that sucked - when the whole purpose of the site is to get your information about a specific topic or check in on a specific topic.

Eventually, users do scroll out of the topic and that's when people's purpose for staying on reddit changes: they move more towards the entertainment side of things with memes, circlejerking, and simply discussing and hanging out with like-minded individuals (or starting an argument with them over something fringe in regards to the topic at large). And keep in mind this is only 10% of the user base doing this form of contribution - the banter that's needed to sustain the quality of Reddit. The other 90% of users will realize something is off when things like this go missing, simply because it's entertaining to not just engage in, but also to read and watch from a lurker standpoint.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The theme here is that he doesn't even care enough to create the illusion of caring. The community was never given "democratic" solutions to dysfunctional mod situations until this business reason arose. There's no community liaison trying to do damage control or make the users feel heard right now -- just the CEO himself telling everyone in the plainest terms that nothing they say has any impact because he does not care. People should take all of this at face value.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

His inability, or unwillingness, to even put on a show of trying to finesse the community is one of the strangest things about the situation. Handling things in the most ridiculously hamfisted way he could and picking a huge fight with the people that provide him with free content and moderation, and right before the IPO... it's just so bizarre and dumb.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

Mr. Huffman is stretching in a variety of directions here. Reddit is not a feudal government, or a city in any sense; neither is it ultimately “democratic,” as he frequently suggests. It’s an advertising and subscription-supported web service that also depends on free content and unpaid labor from its users. It is, substantially, in the same business as Meta, YouTube, Twitter, and TikTok — giving people something to use mostly for free in exchange for their monetizable time and attention.

I really appreciated this callout in the article.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

landed gentry

democratic

Bro, that's just a little too much bullshit coming from your mouth for me.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

Dude, my bullshit meter blew its fuses and the magic smoke's poured out.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

No users, no Reddit. It's as simple as that. Why the paint huffer thinks he can take content from his users for free, then sell it back to them, is mystifying. No, no, dickhead. You're acting like you're the most important component of Reddit when you are, in fact, the most expendable.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago (7 children)

I was definitely addicted to reddit but it's been surprisingly easy to stop using it. I have been reading instead and I'm 75% of the way through Wool right now. Before I would endlessly scroll through but now when I open reddit I am bored in a few minutes. I'll probably still use it to find useful answers on Google but otherwise 🤷‍♀️

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

I don't think I would have broken away without Kbin/Lemmy. Turns out I was addicted to discussion, not Reddit.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

That's kinda what you find out over time and as you see platforms crumble.

the platform itself is just a wrapper for the discussions. If you can find somewhere with those discussions? The wrapper is irrelevant.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

There really is no other large social media site that allows you to converse with actual people. Youtube and Twitter are all about chatting with the content creator, trying to get their attention. Facebook is for getting yelled at by distant relatives. Fortunately Kbin and Lemmy where there to catch us.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

I was definitely addicted to reddit but it's been surprisingly easy to stop using it

The last time I closed the Apollo app was last Sunday night, and I haven't been back since. And each day gets easier on two fronts:

  1. Time = distance from what was an everyday habit.
  2. Engagement here is increasing noticeably by the day.
[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

I've always been pretty good about limiting my casual reddit browsing to only when I have literally nothing else I can productively do with my time, so I'm very pleased that for the most part Lemmy and kbin can already pretty effectively fill that gap for me despite containing a fraction of the firehose that is reddit.

And you're absolutely right that it's a great excuse to refocus on any other hobby.

load more comments (4 replies)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

I'm kinda glad Reddit is blowing up, it has been shit for a long time to be honest. Yes you can seclude yourself into smaller and more niche subreddits, but they all end up catering to the lowest common denominator eventually. If fediverse really kicks off I'm sure the same thing will happen in 10 years, but for now I'm excited to be trying something new

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

If third party reddit browsing apps are competitors to reddit, that means that I have preferred their competitors this whole time! I think I am going to stick with reddit competitors.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

I'm enjoying learning about the alternatives though.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (3 children)

I hope Spez gets explosive diarrhea every day for the rest of his life.

And if for some weird reason he is into that, then I hope he gets concrete constipation every day for the rest of his life instead.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

As a bearer of IBS, this is evil. I like it.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›