Lord of the memes

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Think, Gandalf, THINK! (lemmy.world)

submitted 8 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Are you implying the eagles are Valar? What you say about the Valar intervening is true but the eagles are mortal beasts. The reason I've heard most often is that eagles are not stealthy enough, Sauron would see them coming and counter them with fell beasts, nazgul, archers, siege engines etc. This kind of assault is exactly what Sauron expects from someone who just claimed the ring for themselves and what he is prepared for. Gandalf stresses that the quest relies on secrecy and stealth. If the eagles going to war would wreck middle earth, wouldn't it have happened during the battle of the five armies? Or at the battle of the black gate?

[–] [email protected] 13 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

Manwë controls the eagles, and he is a Valar (he the top man too).

The war of wrath is the event that happened at the end of the first age, near the end of the Silmarillion. Melkor/Morgoth (ex-valar, sauron was his subordinate/lieutenant) didn't want to sing the song with his friends so he went and made himself king of middle earth (sing his own song). For centuries he worked in the shadows and eventually out in the open to enslave everyone and wage war, make orks etc ..

The valar intervened with armies of all sorts (including Mayars like Gandalf) and the war went on for years, even sinking continents and changing the shorelines from water levels rising. If I remember correctly this is also the specific event that kicked Valinor (the land of the undying) out into its own plane of existence, forever severing the natural ways of travel between Valinor and middle earth. Can't ride there directly over water anymore you need the magic boat, so mortals cant go.

After that they said they were not to mess with middle earth anymore because it just escalates the power struggle and breaks shit. So Manwë waits until the people of middle earth figure it out, then sends the eagles to help frodo as soon as he can. Iirc they also helped in other minimal ways which is more apparent in the books, and of course the Mayar (Gandalf and friends) who are there to help.

And the eagles are mortal, but they aren't afraid of fighting and waging war, as the meme was implying. They wouldn't themselves wreck middle earth, but the Valar intervening with their various powers would, or at least it's what they believe.

Edit: right they help in the movies too, for example by sending Gandalf back after he "dies", with Sarumans powers. (Gandalf the White).

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago

If I remember correctly this is also the specific event that kicked Valinor (the land of the undying) out into its own plane of existence, forever severing the natural ways of travel between Valinor and middle earth.

No, that happened after the fall of Númenor, as recounted in the Akallabêth.