this post was submitted on 02 Feb 2024
48 points (82.4% liked)
Climate - truthful information about climate, related activism and politics.
5289 readers
448 users here now
Discussion of climate, how it is changing, activism around that, the politics, and the energy systems change we need in order to stabilize things.
As a starting point, the burning of fossil fuels, and to a lesser extent deforestation and release of methane are responsible for the warming in recent decades:
How much each change to the atmosphere has warmed the world:
Recommended actions to cut greenhouse gas emissions in the near future:
Anti-science, inactivism, and unsupported conspiracy theories are not ok here.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
The downside is almost certainly structural (significant weight as well as moisture, and a need for long term structural integrity and safety, likely don't pair well. Especially not when the people doing the building are looking for cost effectiveness).
If you don't build with cardboard this problem is very easy to solve, its called putting a goddam Pond liner between the dirt and the structure itself.
And the weigh isn't a issue with low buildings, say 10 to 20 floor that aren't made from cardboard, and higher than that is inefficient in all regards anyway and should be avoided.
lol, sure, that sounds super fucking safe.. 🙄
I suggest you look in to building regulations and how developers do their utmost to circumvent them before you speak with such confidence about something you clearly know nothing about.. fucking pond liner smmfh.... 😂🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️
Idk the English word for it, but there is a kind of foil that is water resistant and where roots cant go through, as long as its not a tree or something at least. Its put between the foundation and the walls to stop water from below.
Pond liner is just what the translator got out, its probably incorrect.
Also im talking about this
Not planting literal trees on balconys, that would be a structural problem, yes. But small shrubs and Twiners would do the trick as well if not better in regards of cooling and weight. They also don't need much soil or and significantly less water.
Also can you stop spamming emojis?
That looks like fiver finger ivy.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedera_helix
Its this one in the picture
Who spit in your cereal
No idea but i kinda wish it was me, they're super annoying
How heavy do you think plants are ? Heavier than furniture? Or just fat humans ?
Well if we're talking fully grown oak trees for some stupid reason it'd be heavy, but most of the plants people point at in these things would be light as fuck. The dirt for the planters would probably be heavier.
Maybe some people are thinking trees. But no I expected potted plants. Shrubs of the like
Plants + dirt + water = significant additional weight to consider when designing a building for the people and their furniture..
Buildings today are already being designed with only the bare essentials in mind, they aren't even built with safety in mind only cost effectiveness (see Grenfell and million other buildings like it that should be condemned).
I never said it can't be done, but the person I replied to asked what the downside is, and from a developers' point of view, that will be it.
Water is heavy, and plants are made of mostly water.
Ok. Is water heavier than steel ? I think most buildings can support a bunch of plants
The issue I was trying (and failing) to get at is the additional weight the building now has to support on top of everything else a building normally has to support. However, it doesn't seem to be a big deal judging by everyone's replies.
Short info https://www.bbr-server.de/bauarchivddr/archiv/dokumente/3-4-17-wohnungsbauserie-wbs70.pdf
The blueprints https://bauarchivddr.bbr-server.de/bauarchivddr/archiv/dokumente/3-4-01-2-wohnungsbauserie-wbs-70-6-3-t.pdf
This is the blueprints of a pre modern apartment building (its in German but you could use chat pdf if you need translation) more modern buildings use these as basis (modified versions of course) as these block buildings are modular, cheap, very resistant and reliable. They can definitely support the extra weight of some plants on the facade, nobody wants to plant trees on the building, that wouldn't necessarily be a weight problem but rather a problem with the roots damaging the building, and you can't really stop tree roots, maybe some smaller trees but definitely not Oaks or Fruit trees.
That’s awesome, thanks for the info!
No problem
I have no idea. Not an architectural engineer.
My assumption would be that they have to build the building to a code that has a minimum weight requirements.
Male Humans are generally averaging about 80kg.
If you have a party and have 10 - 15 over. That's a lot of weight. Not all the time but I think if every apartment had a few plants then the weight would still be less than having a party.
Or that was my assumption anyway. I know balconies have a weight limit, as there was a story about a party and too many people were out on it and it collapsed
Depends on the plants...
Also... Humans are mostly water as well if you go by that. I know my balcony supports 3,2 (+ the required tolerance) metric Tons of weight on a area of 10 square meters.
I could plant a tree there. Probably more than one. And these building concepts are rather about small plants, so the weight shouldn't be a problem if you build with Reinforced Concrete like a normal person.
Except that plants grow… and grow, and grow. Unless they’re maintained, which takes additional labor and people and infrastructure to handle, all of which adds even more weight.
As said, you don't need to use trees or gigantic plants, use Twiners and shrubs, they cover the whole facade and don't way that much, yet they do the same, if not a better job at keeping the building cool and the air cleaner. They don't need much maintenance and they don't grow indefinitely, if the plant cant reach more facade it stops, only thing is you have to regularly cut the plants around the windows, wich isn't a gigantic problem.
For now, if richish people want to pay for it in their flat, go for it. (It would be interesting to see the carbon cost of the extra materials though!) They can pay for the building and maintenance, and everyone else gets a cool building to look at.
The hopefully the kinks get worked out and it can be done cheaper on other buildings.