this post was submitted on 27 Jun 2024
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[–] [email protected] 7 points 5 months ago (3 children)

But how do we produce enough batteries for renewable energy?

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Pumped hydro? Or one of the many other non battery storage options, or just over production

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 months ago (1 children)

How viable is pumped hydro? It would be good if feasible, but last I checked, there were not enough places where you can install them.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

No, you're right. It's not an option for everyone. Which is why I mentioned that there are many other solutions which are similar and over production which is simpler and cheaper

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Which options, can you specify?

[–] [email protected] -5 points 5 months ago (2 children)

What? You don't have Google? Options I know of (other than batteries and pumped hydro) : Compressed Air Energy Storage, Thermal Energy Storage,, Fly wheels, Hydrogen, Supercapacitors, Gravitational Storage

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 months ago (2 children)
  1. It's not easy to go over all options.
  2. Many of these are largely theoretical, or for temporary storage. For instance, I don't think fluwheels can store energy for months.
[–] [email protected] 3 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Are you proposing that the sun may not shine and the wind not blow anywhere at all for months?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 months ago

Yeah, it is like that in some places. Also solar flux vary a lot by seasons as well. Dunno if wind has as much of an issue, but surely not great.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago

Nobody wants energy stored for months. Whatever storage is used needs to get through temporary decreases in efficiency. In places that use solar, that means from one afternoon to the next morning. In places that use wind, it means until the wind picks up. We're talking storage on the order of tens of hours at the most.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 months ago (1 children)

The fact that you descend into complete science fiction should give you pause for thought. I doubt it will, but please think about how fantastical your proposed solutions are - "a massive lake of molten salt under every city" (I actually like that one!)...

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Given you're making up things I never said I can only imagine what you're respinding to? Where did a massive lake of molten salt under every city come from?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Sorry this is a late reply. I can see that mentioning molten salt was a bit left-field, However, it is one of the more realistic ways to store the huge amounts of power needed to fuel an economy for a couple of weeks (which you need in northern europe if you want to use solar/wind). Here's a link about it:

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/cite.202000137

I am pro nuclear, but if we are going to descend into this renewable hell, then we need to actually think about how you store terawatt-hours of power. I really think that this kind of storage might be the nearest we have to a solution. we'll only need it once we try to turn off the gas turbines, of course. It is fascinating that so many smart people don't see that the whole jigsaw is missing vital pieces.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Pumped hydro requires a specific sort of place and not sure there's enough of them for most countries to rely on.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago

Correct. That's why I enumerate a bunch itf other options for the other guy who said the same thing.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Redox flow, sodium ion, iron air, etc.

There are some 600+ current chemical-based battery technologies out there.

Hell for me, once sodium is cracked, that shit is so abundant that production wouldn't have many bottlenecks to get started.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Will Li-ion battery companies let that happen? They want profit, which means they want to keep the high battery cost.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Oil & Gas companies didn't want Solar, Wind, and Storage to proliferate, yet they did because of cost savings.

I think we could start to see that for these alternative-ion batteries if lithium supply ever becomes an issue. There will always be a niche that has the opportunity to grow in the economy. Just takes the right circumstances and preparation

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago

True, but gotta see. Currently these companies are so minor.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago

Price driven consumption has been done by industrial users for decades. And countries like UK has been storing energy in storage heaters at home for decades as well. EVs can do wonders here.