this post was submitted on 12 May 2025

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Installing Linux Doesn't Need to Change. The Experience Does. (peertube.wtf)

submitted 2 days ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (5 children)

Just saying, not my experience. I have used linux for over 25 years and nontechnical users in my family have also for almost 20 years. By in large it has worked just fine.

The big issue is Linux is not the OS that is supplied when people go to the store and buy something (well except for Android and Chromebooks which are Linux and are popular). It is also not the system or have the apps their friends use. It also does not have the huge supply, support, and word of mouth ecosystem. Buying hardware especially addons is confusing. Getting support is hard unless you have friends that use. Buying Linux preinstalled often costs more. Change too is hard and there has to be some driver and for most people there is not.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 day ago (5 children)

Or users could maybe learn how to do things without having their hands held and treated like babies every step of the way; or at least how to search for information to find what they need... 🤷🏻‍♂️

[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 day ago (2 children)

A person can only specialize in a small number of things.

I’m happy to learn about computers, but when it comes to, say, cars, I have no desire to learn. If I have a car problem, I don’t have the knowledge of how to even look up a problem.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

Can you put gas in your car? Do you know how to check your oil and add more? Can you put wiper fuild in? Do you know how to check coolant levels?

Most importantly: do you know how to RTFM to do this stuff if needed?

That would put you miles above the typical PC using idiot that we keep coddling by ruining things we use.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 day ago (1 children)

In today world, you don't need to specialize in something to fix basic issues. Simple online search will help you with most basic issues You encounter which is probably 60-70% issues most people have with cars, computers or etc.

I don't blame people that they can't recompile a kernel, applying a patch to fix some random issue. But I blame people that didn't want to spend 30s on searching how to fix their minor issue like for example checking execute permission for appimage, Search engines today even tell you how to do it in a small AI window on top of the page.

Internet really helped people to gain a basic knowledge in a matter of seconds and yet they still don't want it

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 day ago

Just built a new PC literally this weekend. WiFi mouse and Bluetooth drivers did not work out of the box. I had to spend hours searching through what little info exists out there tangentially related to my problem to find:

WiFi drivers were fixed in kernel 6.10, which fortunately Mint let's you upgrade to 6.11 at this time with relative ease.

Bluetooth drivers do not appear to have been fixed, but I might have a shot if I switch over to a rolling release distro and relearn everything I'm used to from using Debian-based distros for years. Dongle is on order, but I don't love having to have 2 bluetooth devices.

It's unclear if mouse drivers have been fixed in the kernel, but I was able to find a nice set of drivers/controller on github which fixed some mouse problems but only if i used their experimental branch and it did not work with my wireless adapter. Very fortunately I had an old wireless adapter from a mouse from the same brand that was able to close the loop, but that was just dumb luck.

By EOD today I should have everything I want working, but it wasn't "30s" of searching - to your point, 60-70% of problems may be solvable that way, but having 1/3 of your problems require technical expertise is not going to bring Linux out of the hobbyist domain.

Note: this is not a complaint against Linux, just a statement of fact. These things have gotten a lot better over the years, and things get easier to find as the community grows and these struggles get discussed more openly, but there's still lots of challenges out there that take more than a 30s search.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 day ago (1 children)

search for information when Google intentionally lies to you and hides results to keep you on their site looking at ads longer …

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

Adblockers will fix part of that. Using the "web" link on the results will make the search a lot better, too.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Or, maybe yo will understand when you grow up that people are good at different things.

Garuntee there's some pretty easy things for me to do that you would get left behind trying to do, and not just on PC

Same for you. You know some things you'd blow me away doing.

Just because you don't know what I know , and vice versa, doesn't mean people are dumb.

Means they've learned different things.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Nah, I get that we're all good at different things. But people should be good at doing basic research and troubleshooting.

We use computers all the time. Many of us use cars all the time. And we know how to fuel them up, check and top-up oil, add wiper fluid, check coolant, etc. There's also the manual to refer to if we don't know.

Same shit with PCs. But people aren't willing to put in the bare minimum effort to do shit, and companies take advantage of that to ruin it for everyone.

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

They could. But you and I both know they won't because most people don't care about anything beyond 'make the magic box work so I can do my job / play my game / etc.'

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Because we keep feeding them stupid pills and encouraging them not to think. Microsoft was a pioneer of the whole "water down software and call it user-frienfly'" thing.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 days ago (7 children)

Yeah I love linux, but it's user experience , while light years ahead of what I used in the late nineties and early aughts, is still clunky compared to others.

That being said, honestly most of linux's issues are GUI related, when it comes to going mainstream. The capabilities and efficiency are far ahead of windows and mac os but most users don't care.

Directions, examples and mundane work should all be seamless for mainstream consumers.

A good rule of thumb is, " if a user has to look for it to fix it, or open a terminal window to install software, then it won't be accepted fully.

Mainstream users don't want to type commands in a prompt. Why does everyone think windows blew DOS out of the water in sales? It wasn't because DOS wasn't working. It was, hell early windows ( I started on 3.11 so that's my limit of knowledge ) still used DOS.

So bottom line. Start putting the non tech consumer first or we'll forever be stuck in this "almost mainstream" category forever.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

Idk mainstream users should learn to learn and empower themselves with knowledge.

The enshitification of hardware and software by constantly catering to the dumbest of people is hurting everybody.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

This exactly.

I enjoy the level of control I have on my Linux machine but I spend about 40% of my time in CLI.

I recently had to troubleshoot a windows machine, and the lack of control was frustrating but every step for that problem was GUI-centric. Everyday people don’t want to remember commands so they can set up their browser and word processor. They want (to them) simple and straightforward.

To us it’s a low bar, and most of us are from the generations that dreamt of a predominantly tech-literate society, but that’s not reality. We have to meet them where they are, and if they want to learn beyond that then we welcome them in.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago

Super glad you understand my point. it honestly is the one thing holding us back I believe

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 day ago

is still clunky compared to others.

Wut?

[–] [email protected] -2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

So bottom line. Start putting the non tech consumer first or we'll forever be stuck in this "almost mainstream" category forever.

I'm okay with that.

"Mainstream" users are getting stupider. Even Windows is to difficult for them. They want the Apple walled garden with a subscription plan for their devices and no permissions to do anything that a corporation doesn't want you to do.

Fuck. That.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago (2 children)

So. We just encourage ignorance and security threats so we.. can.. be .. better than them? I don't think that's the healthiest outlook ...

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Wut?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Are seriously that obtuse.? Why would Anyone think any better of your conversation when that is the level of discourse you bring?

"Wut? " What a classic symptom of the dumbing down of society, but you go ahead and keep feeling superior