this post was submitted on 21 Mar 2025
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[โ€“] [email protected] 54 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children)

Please expand it to Canada too. We need a real alternative to Visa, Mastercard, American Express and Discover.

[โ€“] [email protected] 21 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (3 children)

Canada shares a land border with Denmark and a maritime border with France.

I think that is sufficient to include them in any extended EU schemes.

(To the degree that they want it, of course)

[โ€“] [email protected] 15 points 1 week ago (1 children)

France shares a land border with Brazil, we should get them into the EU as well.

[โ€“] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago (2 children)

I can support this.

Brazil and Suriname back into the European world.

๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿ‡ท๐Ÿ‡ธ๐Ÿ‡ท

[โ€“] [email protected] 5 points 1 week ago

Oof, yeah, sounds bad when you phrase it like that.

[โ€“] [email protected] 5 points 1 week ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Yes, more European colonialism. That worked out really well in the past...

Oh wait.

[โ€“] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Canada shares a land border with Denmark

๐Ÿค”

A maritime border with France.

๐Ÿค”

[โ€“] [email protected] 11 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Canada shares a land border with Denmark

Brave men & women fought over Hans Island in the Whisky War, and the resulting land border is a testament to their bravery, livers, and the determination to find a longlasting solution to land disputes!

[โ€“] [email protected] 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Isn't that about that disput where everynow and then a group of military from each country would go up a hill, plant a flag and leave a bottle of booze, just for the other country to take it down and swap the bottle?

If so, I've seen less convoluted ways to make friends.

[โ€“] [email protected] 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Yes. It was solved in 2022 by dividing the island by a natural rift. However it was also decided that anyone who come to the island can travel the entire island without border control.

[โ€“] [email protected] 1 points 1 week ago

Finally! Crazy bickering.

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[โ€“] [email protected] 4 points 1 week ago

Hans Island in the Arctic for Denmark and Saint Pierre and Miquelon, which is a small island off the eats coast of Canada, which remains a part of France.

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[โ€“] [email protected] 34 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (18 children)

Too bad about crypto.

This is the exact kind of situation it was meant to deal with: finance independent of bad entities. But itโ€™s such a dumpster fireโ€ฆ

I donโ€™t think thereโ€™s a purer example of social media engagement hype, predatory capitalism, and disinformation ruining something neat so quick.

[โ€“] [email protected] 17 points 1 week ago (1 children)

There is GNU Taler which is quite cool, but thats not really ready for use yet sadly.

[โ€“] [email protected] 7 points 1 week ago (7 children)

Oh yeah, that seems really cool. The core premise is much more practical.

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[โ€“] [email protected] 12 points 1 week ago (4 children)

social media engagement hype, predatory capitalism, and disinformation ruining something

I mean, it still works for getting around Visa and Mastercard. For instance it can be used to make donations to various media piracy groups. It's just that it's so useful to scammers and many people see the technology as a whole as being one 'brand'.

[โ€“] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children)

Itโ€™s more than a perception problem now, itโ€™s a culture one within the crypto community (as far as I can tell).

Even if you treat the most prominent crypto as a utility, the sea of hype and speculation will affect you.

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[โ€“] [email protected] 9 points 1 week ago

It really depends on the cryptocurrency in question. Some coins are much more credible than others. Lumping them all in together is like saying that the Japanese Yen and the Lebanese Pound are the same.

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[โ€“] [email protected] 29 points 1 week ago (3 children)

GNU Taler seems to be a good thing to look into. Not a crypto currency but a payment system which preserves anonymity of the buyer.

[โ€“] [email protected] 10 points 1 week ago

Yay GNU Taler is very promising, but I fear banks prefer proprietary systems.

It may become widely used if there's strong customer demand for GNU Taler, or regulation requiring an open electronic wallet. Most banks would probably be dragging their feet.

[โ€“] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago

It has been a while since this appeared; I wonder if it picks up steam. Now or never?

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[โ€“] [email protected] 25 points 1 week ago (1 children)

There's Wero, a European alternative to VISA and Mastercard.

[โ€“] [email protected] 13 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Is it? Doesn't look like they offer debit/credit cards.

Looks more like a PayPal alternative.

[โ€“] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Itโ€™s based on iDEAL, which we use in the Netherlands since 2005. All the Dutch banks are connected to it and when you pay, you approve the payment in your banking app or website, after which itโ€™s immediately deducted from your bank account and the webshop gets an instant payment confirmation. Variations of this are also used peer to peer, for example for splitting the bill or when buying second hand stuff. You send someone a payment request (url) or show a QR and payments arrive instantly on your bank account, without any fees.

So indeed, even though itโ€™s immensely popular and widely used, itโ€™s not a full replacement for physical debit cards and it doesnโ€™t offer credit.

[โ€“] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Every country in the EU has some system for direct debit payments.

Italy has Bancomat, Germany has EC/Giro, France has Carte Bleue, Belgium has Bancontact/Mister Cash (still have not figured out whether they're supposed to be different or just different names in Flanders and Wallonia), and so on and so forth.

Does the Netherlands not have such a system?

It used to be that people would use these within their own country, but there would be Maestro for payments around Europe.

MasterCard decided to discontinue Maestro for MasterCard Prepaid which has higher fees.

The Germans whined about it a little and said that Europe should have come up with its own payment systems, but nothing came of it.

By now we are also supposed to have SEPA Instant, that should offer Europe-wide bank transfers. I still have not quite understood why a debit card system can't leverage that directly.

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[โ€“] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago

Yup thatโ€™s the current state of it. They say theyโ€™re planning to add in-store and online payment options though

[โ€“] [email protected] 5 points 1 week ago

It's a PayPal alternative, but developed in tandem with most European banks. That way, it will at some point also be used as backend for your normal debit and credit card payments, instead of VISA / MasterCard. If I remember correctly.

[โ€“] [email protected] 23 points 1 week ago

I would love to have an EU bank card. Hope we get one soon.

[โ€“] [email protected] 15 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (3 children)

The EU plans this for many year, but the problem is every country is doing its own thing with its own standard, that is not working anywhere else. In Germany for example we have Giropay as a solution, which doesn't work in other countries. As it turns out, people move though, that's why for a couple of years now every bank is switching to VISA debit cards...

[โ€“] [email protected] 11 points 1 week ago (1 children)

As far as I know, Giropay is being replaced by Wero, which is already supported by some banks in different European countries.

It is so far one if the better PayPal/Visa/MasterCard alternatives Iโ€˜ve used, but adoption is still a problem.

[โ€“] [email protected] 3 points 1 week ago

Yeah Iโ€™ve got a notification about Wero in my Sparkasse App but havenโ€™t bothered checking it out yet lol

I have a couple of friends that seem to like it tho, I just rarely send any money

[โ€“] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago

Annoyingly, we already have fast transactions as part of SEPA. But they're somewhat inconvenient to do and especially not available by just holding your card in front of a sensor.

If we had a harmonized standard for that we could get rid of Visa and MasterCard. And if we had a common web interface to make SEPA transactions more convenient than manually typing an IBAN into a homebanking interface we could get rid of PayPal as well.

Yes, I know services like that exist but I really hate how the current ones expect me to type the login credentials for my homebanking into a third-party website.

[โ€“] [email protected] 1 points 1 week ago

Exactly. Austria has eps which works well within Austria and with Austrian companies online, but no further than that.

[โ€“] [email protected] 14 points 1 week ago

We're so capable, it's crazy we needed to be threatened to realize it.

[โ€“] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Portugal has it's own network, Multibanco, and I know our central bank is working on a system targeted to the SEPA+ area. We already can send money to each other usong our phone number and our fiscal number.

[โ€“] [email protected] 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (6 children)

I'm Portuguese and also lived in other countries in Europe and Multibanco is a vastly superior system to everything else I've seen, but on the ATM side rather than the payments side (everybody seems to have their own payment solution or, like the UK, rely on the likes of Visa and MasterCard) - already back in the 90s in Portuguese ATMs, in addition to withdrawing money, you could check your bank account balance, get a statement with the last transactions on your account and even pay your bills all this well before widespread internet access and online banking: that stuff was way ahead of its time back then.

Right now they've added stuff like touchless mobile payments and transfers, but the rest has caught up with them so you'll find such solutions in most countries plus that whole system is entirely local as it's the product of ages ago (before neoliberalism) the government forcing the banks to get together and create a company - SIBS - under shared ownership of the banks, responsible for setting up and managing a national interbank payment systems.

I wouod even say that the Multibanco system probably helps Portuguese banks maintain market lock-in against external competitors, which does get translated to Portugal having pretty high banking fees compared to the rest of Europe, especially for one of the poorest countries in the EU.

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[โ€“] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago (1 children)
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[โ€“] [email protected] 4 points 1 week ago

fuck YES!

ALSO: fuck plastic bank money, cash is king

[โ€“] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

Dโ‚ฌ will basiclly acomplish this.

Edit: Important FAQ

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