They're betting on their fascist puppet in the US tearing apart NATO, so they don't have to worry about such things when they start eyeing the Baltic states.
this post was submitted on 20 Jan 2025
300 points (92.9% liked)
World News
40009 readers
2037 users here now
A community for discussing events around the World
Rules:
-
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
- Post news articles only
- Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
- Title must match the article headline
- Not United States Internal News
- Recent (Past 30 Days)
- Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
-
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
-
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
-
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
-
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
-
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
-
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
-
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
Lemmy World Partners
News [email protected]
Politics [email protected]
World Politics [email protected]
Recommendations
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
- Consider including the article’s mediabiasfactcheck.com/ link
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
And what, lose another 3 years and a third of the country's young to losing the fight for Estonia? Russia is absolutely incapable of successfully invading anything. They couldn't even stay in Syria when a bunch of untrained militia said they might show up later. Russia is weak.
As long as there is an war going on for the rest of Putin's life, I don't think he cares about the any of those problems.
All he cares about is that if there isn't a war going on, Russians will start to look at what their own government does.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(4 replies)
load more comments
(1 replies)
I'm sorry, but even with the U.S. out of NATO, Russia would get their ass kicked. Putin must know that.
All depends on if NATO as a whole isn't just a bluff. Are the UK, Germany and France, the three remaining major economies after the US leaves, actually going to go to war with Russia over Lithuania (no offense at all toward Lithuanians), for example? That's what he's testing, and that's why he wants the US out.
NATO could crumble and Germany and France would still come to Lithuania's aid, they're an EU member. With NATO gone UK might technically not be on the hook any more but they'd still get into the fray, despite their faults and their insistence that they're not they're still Europeans.
The actually difficult part would be stopping Poland from bee-lining for Moscow, nukes be damned. They don't spend 4.7% of GDP because they plan on sitting back.
load more comments
(8 replies)
NATO is required to come to the defence of any member nation if it is attacked.
On paper, yes. Will they, though?
Yes.
I'm not sure if people know the history of trilateral defense agreements.
Iirc it was the French and English who put their war on hold to fight the Spanish specifically because of a weird defense pact.
load more comments
(16 replies)
NATO was specifically created to counter a Russian invasion, so it would be kinda weird if it didn't do the exact thing it was built for.
load more comments
(1 replies)
This is actually not true.
Article Five states that an attack on one becomes an attack on all. This wording is very specific, and they wrote it with this wording intentionally, to get people to be willing to agree to join.
It does not require counterattacks or declarations of war, merely that you consider an attack on a member an attack on you.
How do people respond to different sorts of attacks? How can they theoretically respond if they so choose? These are the kinds of games being played in Putin's head.
Article 5
The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognized by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.
Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security.”
https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_110496.htm
As far as mutual defence treaties go Article 5 is worded very strongly and any nation failing to provide assistance to a member nation would find itself a pariah.
The chances that an article 5 event involving Russia doesn’t trigger full scale war are slim to none.
load more comments
(3 replies)
I think the plan is to be ready for WWIII, when China, Russia, Iran, and… haha…. North Korea, team up.
load more comments
(3 replies)
Not if the US gives them troops and arms.
Simultaneously so weak and incompetent that they can't take a village of 80 year olds but so scary that they'll go to war with like a fifth of the planet.
How does the Umberto Eco thing go again?
While there’s no clear evidence of plans to attack NATO, Russia is creating the conditions for it.
This is also a very telling sentence.
“There’s not evidence this is even on their minds or that they would ever attempt such a monumentally stupid move, buuut…just use your 🌈 imagination 💫”
The Telegraph loves this. " MAY OCCUR!!" = It has not been proven mathematically impossible.
While there's no clear evidence of plans to attack NATO, Russia is creating the conditions for it.
Have they read the news within the last 3 years?
NATO is not a monolithic defense shield. There are weak points that Russia can go after.
The Baltics are made up of very small nations that Russia even in its current state could roll through in a few days.
Once they take those countries they can just sit on them and declare that they will use nukes to defend them.
That leaves NATO in a very bad position militarily of having to retake those countries with the very real threat of nuclear war. It will test the resolve of Alliance members especially those who aren’t immediately adjacent to Russia and are not threatened by them militarily. Will they risk the lives of their people?
Combine that action with China trying to take Taiwan and a US that is not very reliable under Trump and it’s not nearly as cut and dry as you think it may be.
The Baltics are made up of very small nations that Russia even in its current state could roll through in a few days.
They thought that about Ukraine as well... It's 2025 and the Russian border is probably one of the most observed in the world right now. The chances of a Blitzkrieg style attack is nil.
That said if there was ever a time for the EU to start building up its war machine, that time is now.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(3 replies)
It takes Russia weeks/months to take a tiny village at the cost of thousands of soldiers. They can't attack NATO.
I mean they can... but it would go as expected.
Until the US starts giving them munitions because we have to fight the deep state/globalists that infect Europe.
They're all Hamas.
load more comments
(1 replies)
Russia has faced a tiny fraction of NATO's combined military strength and has failed to produce any meaningful results. Attacking NATO would be suicidal
Yeahhhh, but what if someone in charge of the US sides with them instead of against them.
load more comments
(11 replies)
While there’s no clear evidence of plans to attack NATO, Russia is creating the conditions for it.
Holy clickbait. How is this article allowed
load more comments
(2 replies)
An armchair analyst take here but I think they are gearing up to finally try to take Pokrovsk in the spring.
Folks at lemmy.ml were shouting from the rafters most of last year: Invading Kursk was a mistake! Russia will drive them back, and Pokrovsk will fall any day now! But like Avdiivka, I expect it to be a siege and for it to take a while. If they can take it early enough this year, Russia will again be able to conquer massive swaths of farmland because that's really the only thing the "throw bodies at the problem" strategy is very effective at. If Ukraine holds out until the late fall, Russia will again be stalled for months, so the pace of their entire army will be "1 regional hub per year", which I'm not sure is sustainable for Russia's economy and society.
Honestly the pace of Russian advancement has been slowing down which is understandable because their losses are not sustainable. Their only hope for true victory is if Ukrainian losses are even less sustainable.
This is possible, especially if Germany and the US, the 2 wealthiest partners, cut off or scale back aid. But at the moment Ukraine seems slightly ahead of the attrition game and the US just INCREASED sanctions.
Perun (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EHUQmJCa3aY) just released a video yesterday that went over Ukraine's war material situation.
TLDW: Ukrainian military equipment is for the most part qualitatively better than it was at the start of the war but not quantitatively.
Russia on the other hand is qualitatively worse, is running out of reserve war equipment (Soviet stockpiles), and is expected to deplete some of categories of equipment sometime in 2024 (tank stockpile source: Covert Cabal https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=K8CcuVCDEUw).
Edit: some spelling mistakes.
load more comments
(1 replies)
lmao, russians can stockpile rocks and have their propaganda call it best weapon ever.
As my GM once said, right before I TPK’d my whole group: “You can certainly try.”
Kinda seems like Russia is getting fucked up pretty badly already and they haven't even taken one country. Seems doubtful they would have much luck against an alliance.
If the US leaves that alliance and then starts surreptitiously sending drone parts to Russia, it'll get dicey.
If the AfD forms a coalition government with the normal conservatives and Germany decides to turn inwards and keep Deutsche money für die Deutscher, it'll get dicey.
If Macron finally completes his heel turn and appoints Marine le Pen to interior secretary...
If Italy keeps going the way they've been going...
If the Finnish right decides that joining NATO was a mistake that let too many minorities in...
If the rest of Africa goes along with the Sahel nations and starts funneling their resources into the Russian war machine...
If Modhi lets Russia open more factories in India...
If China decides that they're cool with sharing power on the global scale and fully buys in on the BRICS bloc...
Russia looks weak right now because the invasion has been such and embarrassment, but that can change surprisingly quickly. The global shift towards authoritarianism is coming hand-in-hand with a shift away from US/Eurocentric hegemony.
Code review came back. Too many nested ifs.
These arent nested. Any of these can happen independently and any one of them happening makes some others more likely to happen too.
Each of them adds to shifting the balance of power and noone knows where the breaking point is.
Of course there is also a few IFs going the other way around, or were we just know it will have an impact but not which way
If the Russian people get fed up with the economy...
If Putin dies...
If Trump dies...
If Xi dies...
If there is an escalation in South East Asia...
If there is a further escalation in West Asia...
If there is a major climate event in Russia/Eastern Europe/Western Europe/North America...
load more comments
(5 replies)
view more: next ›