this post was submitted on 20 May 2025
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Approval and STAR are better anyway. Not that they wouldn't find a piss poor excuse to ban those as well.
STAR? Sure.
Approval? Nah
Gonna copy paste my comment again:
I can see a bit of strategic voting happening.
Let me demonstrate:
For the sake of simplicity, let's say we have 3 candidates, and no term limits:
Trump, Biden, Sanders
Biden and Sander voters dispise trump, their preference in RCV is (example):
Biden>Sanders>Trump: 30%
Sander>Biden>Trump: 25%
Trump>Sanders>Biden: 23%
Trump>Biden>Sanders: 22%
Okay, so lets say they all approve their top 2:
Biden: 77%
Sanders: 78%
Trump: 45%
Okay we have president Sanders! Congrats, right?
Well, now the trumpers who approved sanders are like: "Hey wait a minute, we made our daddy lose because we approved Sanders"
All the trumpers now have a meeting and decided that next election, they don't approve Sanders or Biden as a strategic vote.
So now, Election 2 Results:
Biden: 55%
Sanders: 55%
Trump: 45%
Oh great, it's a tie. The law says that the election have to be re-done to solve the tie:
Now this next election, all people who preferred Sanders first go to a Sanders supporter meeting and started saying: "Lets disapprove Biden so Bernie can win!"
Simultaneously, Biden voters will be like: "Lets disapprove Sanders so Biden can win!"
Next election results:
Trump: 45%
Biden: 30%
Sanders 25%
Congrats, we have a glorified FPTP and spoiler effect yet again!
Now, other election systems could also have strategic voting, but its less likely with, for example, RCV, since you can rank candidates.
STAR voting is also acceptable, but its also less heard of, and as far as I know, it hasn't ever been done in a real-life election. I doubt that'll get popular any time soon, might as well find another easier to implement Non-FPTP system to rally behind.
The bigger problem in my opinion is more about the fact that all elections that select a single winner will always end up in stupid degenerate systems like this where flaws and imperfections exist.
The best thing to do (again, my opinion) is to abolish all single winner races and have multiple winners with proportional representation. Get rid of directly elected presidents and have a prime minister selected by a proportionally representative parliament instead. All presidential systems suck, and the larger the number of people voting, the harder and harder it sucks. It's not just a USA problem - you also see it in France and Turkey, where they also have an all-powerful president that is elected nationally and the election is a complete shit-show every time without fail. On the other hand, having a prime minister selected as the head of state from a proportionally elected parliament is a much fairer and more stable system in my opinion. It has downsides too of course, but nowhere near as bad as nationally elected presidential systems.
In any case, the example you pointed out is a potential flaw in approval voting, but I don't think it's very likely to happen. First of all, it would require all those voters in the second round to conspire a particular way, which isn't very likely. Secondly, there's the fact that the numbers would have to line up in a very particular way which has a very low probability of happening - tweak a few numbers here and there, and the spoiler effect vanishes. Sure, the scenario you point out is a hypothetical flaw in approval voting, but I think it's a much smaller effect and probability of actually influencing anything - definitely nowhere near as much of a strategic voting effect as in plurality voting systems.