this post was submitted on 25 Oct 2024
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Linux

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Linux is a family of open source Unix-like operating systems based on the Linux kernel, an operating system kernel first released on September 17, 1991 by Linus Torvalds. Linux is typically packaged in a Linux distribution (or distro for short).

Distributions include the Linux kernel and supporting system software and libraries, many of which are provided by the GNU Project. Many Linux distributions use the word "Linux" in their name, but the Free Software Foundation uses the name GNU/Linux to emphasize the importance of GNU software, causing some controversy.

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[–] [email protected] 108 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (17 children)

Holy shit that got spicy. I was not expecting a Ukrainian and a Serb to start bickering back and forth while stacking racks over the level of support a country gave to the Nazis in WW2 on a kernel mailing list like they were in the comments here on Lemmy.

I get that tensions are high, and for many people the geopolitical reality is their homes being used as cover on an active front line, but like bro your actual fucking name is attached to these messages. At least I keep my most unhinged shit on a semi-anonymous platform. They need to lock it the fuck up.

Edit - jfc, a few messages later somebody comes in with something along the lines of “Taiwan isn’t a country, it’s part of China. When reunification comes sanctions won’t be appropriate against Chinese entities.” Is Lemmy just a front end for this mailing list and I had no idea this entire time?

[–] [email protected] 45 points 1 month ago (2 children)

I thought you were joking, but yup they actually started quizzing eachother on WW2.

It's not the end of Linux by any means, but that's gonna be hard to work together afterwards

[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 month ago

Jeeeeez that was a lot. I get the sense that the kernel has worked as well as it has because people saw it as separate from geopolitics and so didnt discuss them...now that politics has wedged its way in I feel like it may have opened that door permanently.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 month ago

I'm optimistic, since technical arguments can be pretty heated yet they end like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouTXff7lvq4

[–] [email protected] 42 points 1 month ago

At least I keep my most unhinged shit on a semi-anonymous platform.

🔥

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[–] [email protected] 51 points 1 month ago (2 children)

It is not good for the kernel and it's team to suddenly have to kowtow to Usamerican politics.

[–] [email protected] 87 points 1 month ago (8 children)

The reality is that the Linux Foundation is in the United States, and Linus is a naturalized US citizen who lives in Oregon (at least on Wikipedia). So they both will have to pay attention to avoid transacting business with individuals and companies on the SDN list. That is the law in the United States.

[–] [email protected] 36 points 1 month ago (1 children)

What an extremely dangerous place to domicile such an important project.

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 1 month ago

And it can cost you up to 30 years for breaking it. I'd listen to my lawyers too.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Kreg moved to Europe, last I heard. So at least the heir apparent is in a region with better potential international diplomacy and neutrality.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Inheritance wars wasn't something on my FOSS list...

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago (6 children)

Would a fork be the solution to avoid having a system that is crucial for people worldwide cease to be a weapon at the hands of merrican politicians?

[–] [email protected] 38 points 1 month ago (1 children)

It'll be at the hands of whatever jurisdiction the forker is in. It's not like you can escape governments.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago

brazilian linux fork when?

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 month ago (3 children)

I'm afraid that if the sanctions will continue to be a go-to method of dealing with geopolitical rivals, we may end up with a few divergent forks. One for US and "the west" block, one for Chinese comrades with their junior Russian partners, and maybe one for Indian code gurus who don't like both sides and have capable engineering resources themselves.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Could be. Maybe not a hard fork, if this slap fight can be contained in the driver space. I’d keep an eye on OpenHarmony and OpenKylin.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago

This kind of thing is the inevitable outcome of US policy to "decouple", which they are pushing. Take something they nominally control, kick out every designated enemy / enemy collaborator, and then watch as an alternative pops up among the " enemy" and ban its purchase or use.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago

Suddenly? Linux entities have always had to follow the rules of the country they exist in. A kernel isn’t a sovereign nation no matter how loud the what-about army becomes.

[–] [email protected] 44 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

What were Linus comments that precipitated this?

The rage comes from LF actions and Linus words. All they had to do was to say: Thank you people for your contribution but we have no other choice, this is the law. But they did quite the opposite and Linus showed his true ugly white western supremacy face for all to see. That is the cause of the rage.

[–] [email protected] 43 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Ok, lots of Russian trolls out and about.

It's entirely clear why the change was done, it's not getting reverted, and using multiple random anonymous accounts to try to "grass root" it by Russian troll factories isn't going to change anything.

And FYI for the actual innocent bystanders who aren't troll farm accounts - the "various compliance requirements" are not just a US thing.

If you haven't heard of Russian sanctions yet, you should try to read the news some day. And by "news", I don't mean Russian state-sponsored spam.

As to sending me a revert patch - please use whatever mush you call brains. I'm Finnish. Did you think I'd be *supporting* Russian aggression? Apparently it's not just lack of real news, it's lack of history knowledge too.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago (1 children)

No clue how all this shakes out. Not real invested in this ideological/bureaucratic slap fight.

It's always entertaining when Linus flames off.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago

When Linus becomes entertaining is when he is not doing his job properly.

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

https://www.phoronix.com/news/Linus-Torvalds-Russian-Devs

tl;dr: anyone who disagrees is a russian troll or a useful idiot, according to the linux man

[–] [email protected] 31 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (12 children)

Damn there are a surprising number of maintainers that are comrades and not taking this lying down from the western supremacist cohort.

Linus opened up a massive can of worms and turned this into a geopolitical conflict by acting like a baby.

This comment by Hantong Chen is great:

Hi James,

Here's what Linus has said, and it's more than just "sanction."

Moreover, we have to remove any maintainers who come from the following countries or regions, as they are listed in Countries of Particular Concern and are subject to impending sanctions:

  • Burma, People’s Republic of China, Cuba, Eritrea, Iran, the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea, Nicaragua, Pakistan, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Tajikistan, and Turkmenistan.
  • Algeria, Azerbaijan, the Central African Republic, Comoros, and Vietnam.

For People’s Republic of China, there are about 500 entities that are on the U.S. OFAC SDN / non-SDN lists, especially HUAWEI, which is one of the most active employers from versions 5.16 through 6.1, according to statistics. This is unacceptable, and we must take immediate action to address it, with the same reason.

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 month ago

This will be a nothing burger in 6 months

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